Prop not moving in Multi Player

[Norforce]

Spitfire has no rotation in multi-player as per these pic's this was noticed by all in the flight







Ron

[Scott - A2A]

Yes we are aware of this issue when looking at the spitfire from a different aircraft. We are working on this, but not sure if this can be remedied.

Scott.

[Killratio]

Scott,

This is also present looking from Spitfire to Spitfire but there seems to depend on the viewing aircraft's "state"

The other day I was sitting on the tarmac shut down and Ron taxiied towards me. I could see him and his prop was stationary although he was running, he could see me and my prop was moving, although I was shutdown!


Strange


Darryl

[Gypsy Baron]

Scott,

This is also present looking from Spitfire to Spitfire but there seems to depend on the viewing aircraft's "state"

The other day I was sitting on the tarmac shut down and Ron taxiied towards me. I could see him and his prop was stationary although he was running, he could see me and my prop was moving, although I was shutdown!


Strange


Darryl

Yes, I confirm this. If both of your props are turning then you will see them in motion. If your
engine is shut down, all other spits will appear to be shut down as well.

Paul

[CodyValkyrie]

It's an animation trigger. Like many aspects of multiplayer, yet another issue. For example, if you have a plane with drop tanks, ALL planes that have drop tanks will visibly show them, regardless of their real state.

[Killratio]

Cody,

when you say "another issue", do you mean one that can't be fixed mate?

Darryl

[Sayuuk]

It's an animation trigger. Like many aspects of multiplayer, yet another issue. For example, if you have a plane with drop tanks, ALL planes that have drop tanks will visibly show them, regardless of their real state.

Sure, but when all the other planes fly around with drop-tanks, they just fly around like me.
When we take off and land at the same airports it actually makes sense that this is mirrored.


A prop that doesn't turn on the other hand does not make any sense at all.

I sure hope you guys find a way to fix this major bummer in multiplayer if you're not a Spit yourself


Cheers, Stefan

[CodyValkyrie]

It's hard to say whether A2A can fix this issue or not. I will not speak with authority about this.

I can however speak with authority with how FSX handles many multiplayer animations.... and the short is, like CRAP.

When Microsoft coded animations, they never considered the ramifications of a multiplayer atmosphere. I suspect a bit of "legacy" coding is the culprit, although MS did make some progress with SP1/SP2.

The problem is, many animation triggers are set up for the USER AIRCRAFT ONLY.

So while you may see a canopy open, or a landing gear operate properly, some animations such as LVARS simply do not work as they should, primarily because these are not being transmitted from one computer to another, and SimConnect really isn't controlling this from a deep multiplayer aspect.

Confuse anyone yet?

Try this:

1) Load up the A2A P-51, P-40 or P-47.
2) Have your buddy do the same and meet in a multiplayer session.
3) Load up drop tanks for yourself.
4) Notice that if you load, drop, etc your tanks, the animations are also triggered on your buddies aircraft?

This is what is happening with the Spitfire. Because the "engine" is run outside of FSX, there is a missing link. This is also why if you are flying around in a WOP3 Spit, everyone's engine seems fine and the animations play properly. If you are in a B-17, they are not showing as running. It's an animation issue caused by the way Accu-Sim is now handling the engine. I actually predicted this issue at the day of release with Scott on the phone. He confirmed it was somewhat happening like I predicted the day after.

There were a couple of ghost fixes with FSX SP2 that changed a few things, such as the ability to see someone open their canopy. They didn't go much further. You can even trick some of the default animations and triggers if lagged is induced, or they are triggered very quickly. This is why you will see people flying with what appears to be their landing gear down, lights on, etc while the person who appears to be an idiot think YOU are the crazy one. Tap your G button quickly in multiplayer sometime. If it screws up, everyone on the server will see you flying around with your gear down, while YOU show it being up.

Of interesting note, a HUGE problem in multiplayer was fixed with SP2, but never announced publicly. When you fly a "non-default" plane in Multiplayer, if other players in the session are not using the aircraft you are, they will see a type of replacement... So, while you are putting around in your Spitfire, someone else may see a C172, or some other single engine aircraft.

The early problem in multiplayer pre-SP2 was that some aircraft had no default backup... If for example you were flying a B-17, which is a 4 engine prop driven aircraft, there was no default plane to substitute it! The ending result is that in such aircraft, you would be invisible on the server to everyone EXCEPT those who had some type of 4 engine prop aircraft!

Another interesting problem with multiplayer was introduced with FSForce. FSForce now locks out the ability to playback it in multiplayer (unless something has changed). I can safely say "I" am the reason for this.

I was in a small aerobatic team on a major server and recording our show, and all traffic on the server (unbeknown to me). I stupidly decided to try a playback, including AI. Well, it worked. I was able to watch our routine, and judge how we were doing. When the routine was over however, the aircraft didn't disappear! I had even loaded it another 2 times to check various parts of the routine before realizing that the aircraft were not disappearing!

What I had done was record every aircraft on the server, play them all back and they would not be removed. In seconds I had tripled the amount of aircraft on the server. We had over 50 people logged in that day, and suddenly there were planes sitting idly on the runway, some half in takeoff, helos chilling over the tower. Chaos ensued for about 15 minutes, all the while myself and my team laughing loudly as we frantically tried to locate the admin. Eventually the whole server had to be reset because of this mistake.

To this day, if the old FSRecorder is used, this could continue to happen. They patched it immediately, but you could understand that someone with malicious intentions could do some serious harm to an FS server with an old version of FSRecorder... Note, I feel comfortable saying it now because it has been YEARS since this version was available anywhere. We're talking 2006-2007 or so. Microsoft never patched this exploit.

So yes, you should get an idea that Multiplayer in FS is a bit strange. There are a lot of wierd quirks, primarily because they slapped on multiplayer onto a single player game while the ramifications of doing so where not fully known until WAAAY after release. We're still finding strange anomalies to this day.

[Killratio]

Cody,

MY BRAIN HURTS!!!

I'm just going to take that as a "not at the moment"


Darryl

[CodyValkyrie]

After YOUR long winded replies, YOU BETTER READ IT!

[Killratio]

After YOUR long winded replies, YOU BETTER READ IT!

Ok, Mea Culpa ....


(but I HAD read it...why do think myt brain hurts )

D

[CodyValkyrie]

Hahaha... I generally avoid the subject if I can. It always ends the same way. I just hope some of this gets fixed with MS Flight.

And yes, the short answer is that it is being looked into.

[Sayuuk]

So you would need to trigger the Spit prop animation from the B17/P47?


If I understand correctly, this is needed:

- add the animation trigger that makes the Spit prop spin to the B17G and P47. If it is depending on a "real" prop spinning on the B17/P47, maybe a phantom-prop (spins as long as the battery is on, no drag/thrust, no sound) could be used.

If the Spit prop spin is done outside of core-fsx (what I assume), add a phantom prop with the same animation as the real one to the Spit. This way the Spits prop should turn as long as your own prop(s) is/are turning.

I mean, it is working if you're sitting in a Spit yourself, so the trigger itself should be there/accessible, maybe this just requires a small update to the B17/P47 (as these are the main planes flown with the Spit right now in MP)


Just my (amateur) thinking

[CodyValkyrie]

I mean, it is working if you're sitting in a Spit yourself, so the trigger itself should be there/accessible, maybe this just requires a small update to the B17/P47 (as these are the main planes flown with the Spit right now in MP)


Just my (amateur) thinking

You are not thinking far beyond my initial thoughts, however it is much more complicated than that unfortunately.

Furthermore, adding a patch for the old birds isn't acceptable as this will still render the prop non-moving from the view of every other aircraft in a multiplayer session.

For the time being, fly a Spitty with your friends. A2A is looking into solutions, but realistically this is a problem with core FSX and the way it triggers animations in multiplayer.

[Tigerclaw]

This stuff happens with nearly everything I fly in multiplayer. As soon as the model is a little complicated FSX messes it up because it doesn't understand what its supposed to do. Helicopters do it, planes do it, and it wouldn't surprise me if cars and boat addons do it aswell.

Don't waste your time A2A, without rewriting the whole sim I doubt FSX will get it right.

An example: I did a short flight, circuit and landing. Then I shut down, put my acc on, and then did a replay of the last 60 seconds. FSX doesn't actually record the flight (I thought it did), and the replay showed the aircraft in the state I left it on the ground. No spinning prop, with the acc connected and hanging out the front. I would never blame A2A for this, it's an FSX issue that will never be sorted now development has stopped. That's just the way it goes I guess. I won't let it spoil my fun though.