P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

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BigT-65
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P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by BigT-65 »

I just got the new release of the B-17 for P3Dv4. I cannot get it to turn on the ground using the rudder. I can see the rudder working in external mode. I am using EZDok so I have the fuselage shake effects turned off. I am not having any trouble steering any other planes, including A2A aircraft, using the rudder. Is there something I am missing?
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Nick - A2A
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by Nick - A2A »

Hello,

The first thing to check is have you unlocked the tailwheel using the lever on the cockpit floor?

Also bear in mind that differential engine thrust and differential braking will be the most effective way to turn the aircraft at slow speed on the ground. Using the rudder pedals alone won't be enough when taxying.

Thanks,
Nick
A2A Simulations Inc.

alan CXA651
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by alan CXA651 »

Hi Big T-65.
As nick said differential throttle and brakes turn the aircraft on the ground , rudder does nothing till about 60mph on takeoff run , because the tail wheel is a free castor , on the floor rear of pedestal you will see two red levers the right hand is tail wheel lock , which needs to be on while taxiing straight or take off / landing , the left lever is the rudder/elevator control lock , aileron control lock is a pin that locks the wheel to the column , make sure thee are OFF before flight , or it will be a very short flight , on the co-pilots panel you will see a single gear down green light and to the right of this you will see a red light , this is ON when tail wheel lock is OFF .
If you find it is impossible to taxy with differential throttle/brakes , you can edit the aircraft.cfg steering angle from 180 free caster to 60 steered by rudder , but this is not realistic , and you need to know how to edit aircraft.cfg files , and always make a backup copy first before editing.
regards Alan. 8)
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BigT-65
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by BigT-65 »

I do have the tailwheel unlocked. I forgot to mention that. I had an A2A B-17 in FSXSE and although it was difficult to taxi at least I could do it using just the rudder and brakes. The way it is right now I can't even get it to turn at all. I do have a throttle control with two levers and I suppose I could set them up to have one for the two right side engines and one for the two left engines. But I switch around from plane to plane frequently and don't want to do that. Most of the planes I fly are single engine.
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Ray Mengel
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by Ray Mengel »

Something else you may want to try that can help you to taxi and steer through left and right turns--Shift 8 will bring up the "Engine Selector" panel. That will save you from having to program your throttle levers for this aircraft. A description on how to use this gauge is on pg. 131 of the include manual if you need it.

Hope this helps,

Ray

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BigT-65
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by BigT-65 »

Thanks for your input, guys. I am going to work with it. I do like the B-17 but I need to learn how to taxi it.
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Paughco
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by Paughco »

Check this. It's still working, and hasn't changed anything else, other than providing a steerable tailwheel: viewtopic.php?f=29&t=71842.

Seeya
ATB
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BigT-65
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by BigT-65 »

Paughco wrote: 02 May 2021, 11:30 Check this. It's still working, and hasn't changed anything else, other than providing a steerable tailwheel: viewtopic.php?f=29&t=71842.
I tried this adjustment using 72 and also 40 and 60 as mentioned in other posts. None of it made any difference. I could get a very small amount of turning ability with the 40 but not enough to do any taxiing. Is there something I am missing. Do I need to do anything else in addition to the adjustment to the aircraft.cfg file?
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TreeTops
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by TreeTops »

Did you make these changes to the cfg file before you loaded the plane?
Cheers
Trev

sext5vette

Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by sext5vette »

TreeTops wrote: 04 May 2021, 23:24 Did you make these changes to the cfg file before you loaded the plane?
Yes I did. I even rebooted my computer. I have just retried getting the B-17 to turn with no luck. I have tried with the tail wheel locked and unlocked. If I give it almost full throttle, turn the rudder and apply differential brakes with the * or - key I can get a little bit of a turn but it is extremely wide and impossible to taxi on the taxiways.

sext5vette

Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by sext5vette »

TreeTops wrote: 04 May 2021, 23:24 Did you make these changes to the cfg file before you loaded the plane?
I did make the changes before I started the sim and loaded the B-17, I even rebooted my computer. I have tried with the tail wheel locked and unlocked. If I give it almost full throttle, turn the rudder and apply the brakes using either the * or - key I get a little bit of a turn. It's extremely wide and impossible to taxi on the taxiways. This is a copy of the line in my aircraft.cfg file
point.0 = 1, -34.0045, 0, -4.0, 4000, 0, 1, 72, 0.3, 2.5, 0.7, 10, 8, 0, 135, 180

alan CXA651
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by alan CXA651 »

Hi.
What speed are you taxiing at , to get effective steering the speed needs to be 3mph or less.
regards Alan. 8)
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sext5vette

Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by sext5vette »

alan CXA651 wrote: 06 May 2021, 02:58 What speed are you taxiing at , to get effective steering the speed needs to be 3mph or less.
I have tried it at several speeds. In the slowest speeds like 3 mph when it use the differential brakes the plane stops.
Here's something else. I went back to FSX to try taxiing the B-17 there with the FSX version of the A2A B-17. I use to fly the B-17 in FSX frequently and didn't remember having much difficulty taxiing it. Sure enough, taxiing was not that difficult. Something in the configuration of the B-17 must have changed from the FSX version. I tried to find the aircraft.cfg file for the FSX B-17 but have not jet located it. I want to see if it has a similar configuration file. I am going to look for it now, when I find it I will report back.

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Masterius
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Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by Masterius »

I have both FSX:SE and P3DV5, and I can tell you that there is a very noticable difference between the two where it comes to ground friction and rolling resistance (granted, I almost exclusively fly the A2A B-17). In FSX:SE, it starts rolling with a lot less throttle, and smoothly maintains a slow speed, as well as much more easily turns. In P3D, it takes a lot of thrust to break friction and start rolling, and if you don't throttle right back you'll easily hit 20-30 knots without breaking a sweat. As for turning...

If I didn't have four throttles, I'm not sure I could turn, either. Even with using four throttles, turning at a low taxi speed is horrible. Add to that the fact that because of the terrible friction, turning at a low speed almost immediately brings you to a stop.

I've posted on the P3D forum about this. The only comment I ever received was--and I quote:

"Unfortunately, ground friction has been broken since the FSX days (and really, before that) and never got fixed. It's up to individual add-on devs to hack their own ground friction physics into the sim."

Chevalier
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sext5vette

Re: P3Dv4 B-17 can't steer on ground

Post by sext5vette »

Thanks for your reply. I have two throttle levers and I tried mapping engines 1 and 2 to one lever and 3 and 4 to the other lever and it didn't work. I have tried the Shift + 8 engine control and that didn't get it done either, I have modified the aircraft.cfg file as specified and that didn't work either. It worked a little bit but not enough to move the airplane around the airport. Since I had absolutely nothing to do this afternoon I taxied my B-17 from a spot not very far from the runway I needed to get to. This took almost 2 hours and most of the time I was in the grass. When I got to the runway I was perpendicular to it and to turn that 90 degrees I had to go a little forward, back up and repeat about 30 times. I had been using MSFS almost exclusively since I got it for Christmas. I went on the A2A forum site to see any news of aircraft they may be working on for MSFS. When I saw that the B-17 was now out for P3D4 and 5 I was really happy and immediately bought it. So far the only way I can fly it is to start in position on the runway and after the flight when I land just shut it off when I get it stopped. A2A really needs to fix this so us pilots who only have 1 or 2 throttle levers can enjoy it. At this point I feel like I just wasted the money. I guess I will just put it in mothballs and wait for a solution to be offered.

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