Don't know if any body has seen this
http://www.kansas.com/2014/01/01/320643 ... -b-29.html
Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
That's terrific news! I was unaware that the project has been restarted as it was looking very questionable a couple of years ago.
Now we need to find an eccentric billionaire to fund restoring a B-36D to flying condition. Six turning, four burning. (Well, I am allowed to dream right?)
Now we need to find an eccentric billionaire to fund restoring a B-36D to flying condition. Six turning, four burning. (Well, I am allowed to dream right?)
System Specs:
Intel i7-2600 @ 4.3GHz, ASUS P8P67-Deluxe, 8GB DDR3-1600, ATI Radeon HD7770 (2GB), OCZ Vertex 250GB SSD (OS), Seagate 1TB HDD (Data)
FSX w/Acceleration and tons of add-ons.
Intel i7-2600 @ 4.3GHz, ASUS P8P67-Deluxe, 8GB DDR3-1600, ATI Radeon HD7770 (2GB), OCZ Vertex 250GB SSD (OS), Seagate 1TB HDD (Data)
FSX w/Acceleration and tons of add-ons.
- Lewis - A2A
- A2A Lieutenant Colonel
- Posts: 33284
- Joined: 06 Nov 2004, 23:22
- Location: Norfolk UK
- Contact:
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
There's a chance ill be at Oshkosh this year and seeing a B29 fly in will be, well I mean WOW!
A2A Facebook for news live to your social media newsfeed
A2A Youtube because a video can say a thousand screenshots,..
A2A Simulations Twitter for news live to your social media newsfeed
A2A Simulations Community Discord for voice/text chat
A2A Youtube because a video can say a thousand screenshots,..
A2A Simulations Twitter for news live to your social media newsfeed
A2A Simulations Community Discord for voice/text chat
- cflord
- Chief Master Sergeant
- Posts: 2744
- Joined: 30 Dec 2004, 17:07
- Location: Powder Springs, Georgia USA
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Great news. Another old WWII airplane being brought back to life.
Keep the shiny side up and the dirty side down!
Ret SMSgt Cliff Lord - C-130 Flight Engineer & Mechanic
Keep the shiny side up and the dirty side down!
Ret SMSgt Cliff Lord - C-130 Flight Engineer & Mechanic
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Can you even imagine seeing Fifi and Doc flying together? This is actually going to become a possibility... Wow!
Joe
Joe
Joe
- Mig_Driver
- Staff Sergeant
- Posts: 310
- Joined: 25 Nov 2007, 17:37
- Location: Phoenix, AZ (KIWA)
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Joe totally read my mind. I was just thinking FiFi... it would be great if Kee Bird could be restored again too but... maybe she flies best in the past.
ALL THE A2A PLANES!!!
- CAPFlyer
- A2A Aviation Consultant
- Posts: 2241
- Joined: 03 Mar 2008, 12:06
- Location: Wichita Falls, Texas, USA
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Kee Bird's damage is probably far beyond economical repair. The Collings Foundation is fundraising for a B-29, whether it be possibly getting Doc after it's restored or for another airplane (maybe Kermit's?) I suspect that the chances of seeing a 3rd B-29 airworthy is probably another decade away, and by then FiFi may be grounded as she is running out of airframe life.
- Mig_Driver
- Staff Sergeant
- Posts: 310
- Joined: 25 Nov 2007, 17:37
- Location: Phoenix, AZ (KIWA)
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Just the man I was thinkin of, Chris! I was wondering what your estimation of her eligibility for restoration would be after the fire. The new photos look like she lost her tail? Mark Allen needs to get on top of that one. Perhaps a SkyCrane helo could pick up the fuselage and wings separately after being removed by a crew, and placed onto a huge beyond definition cargo vessel...
Well, if I win the lottery anytime soon ( I surmise it would take at least a few million to do it)...
Well, if I win the lottery anytime soon ( I surmise it would take at least a few million to do it)...
ALL THE A2A PLANES!!!
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Isn't 'economic repair' quite a contradiction in terms when talking warbird restoration? Unless you consider 'less money than some eccentric (but in every which way brilliant and loveable) fellow with deep pockets is able to throw at it' economic...CAPFlyer wrote:Kee Bird's damage is probably far beyond economical repair.
Be warned: Aero engineer, real life pilot, sim programmer. Nothing good can come out of that.
- CAPFlyer
- A2A Aviation Consultant
- Posts: 2241
- Joined: 03 Mar 2008, 12:06
- Location: Wichita Falls, Texas, USA
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
I use "economic repair" in Warbird terms by whether the investment in time is worth the return in the air. For the amount of work required to fix the backbone and completely replace the entire section that was burned down on Kee Bird, it would take more years of labor (not to mention money) than there are hours left on the airframe. You would have a zero time second on a plane that has only 100 or so flying hours left on it, so you'd never really make back any of that investment.
Also, when the truckloads of money required to restore the plane turns into trainloads, I think we're getting beyond what even a Mark Allen can afford.
Considering there are at least 3 other B-29's that are in far better shape and could potentially be returned to airworthy status in the US, why spend the money on Kee Bird?
Also, when the truckloads of money required to restore the plane turns into trainloads, I think we're getting beyond what even a Mark Allen can afford.
Considering there are at least 3 other B-29's that are in far better shape and could potentially be returned to airworthy status in the US, why spend the money on Kee Bird?
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Well, judging by the photos of the Kee Bird wreckage, you would need to rebuild almost the entire fuselage. With that in mind, wouldn't it end up with more airframe life, seeing that so much has been rebuilt? From what I understand, the airframe life limitations would be based on pressurization cycles, and therefore the determining factor for its available life. If the plane isn't pressurized, and isn't some composite with a lifetime limit placed on it (i.e. Cessna Corvallis), it can fly as long as its airworthiness can be maintained, i.e. a 1945 DC-3 or B-17, of the same vintage.CAPFlyer wrote:I use "economic repair" in Warbird terms by whether the investment in time is worth the return in the air. For the amount of work required to fix the backbone and completely replace the entire section that was burned down on Kee Bird, it would take more years of labor (not to mention money) than there are hours left on the airframe. You would have a zero time second on a plane that has only 100 or so flying hours left on it, so you'd never really make back any of that investment.
Also, when the truckloads of money required to restore the plane turns into trainloads, I think we're getting beyond what even a Mark Allen can afford.
Considering there are at least 3 other B-29's that are in far better shape and could potentially be returned to airworthy status in the US, why spend the money on Kee Bird?
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Interesting subject. DC-3s, B-17, the DC-3 was called the work horse of the sky. Am I comparing soup to nuts? Look what it took to restore Glacier Girl how many feet of ice she was in? I don't remember not only the frame the entire aircraft was severely damaged. Think it boils down to funding and finding deep enough pockets for the restoration project. If the frame and aircraft is restored to flyable condition does air frame life really matter? It can be built back to new condition. It is about the history and remembrance of the men that flew those beautiful aircraft and the Freedom we all share today. While money certainly plays a big factor not sure you would ever get the investment back out of restoring the majority of the airplanes that have been restored. That brings me around to the second thought it is not about the money invested or the number of man hours for the restoration.
- CAPFlyer
- A2A Aviation Consultant
- Posts: 2241
- Joined: 03 Mar 2008, 12:06
- Location: Wichita Falls, Texas, USA
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Pressurization cycles are only part of how the "life limit" of an airplane is calculated. On unpressurized aircraft, it may be done simply by flight hours on given components or on landing cycles. On the B-29, the Wing Spar is what has the life limit and it is this which will ground FiFi in another 8-10 years based on flying ~100 hours a year. The only way to "zero time" the airframe, whether it be Kee Bird, Doc, or FiFi, would be to replace the entire wing spars, something that is far beyond what anyone would be willing to invest the time and money to do. Doing it on a P-38 or P-51 is one thing as there are plenty of them still flying for one and they are affordable to operate thus there is a return on the investment of essentially building one from scratch (as many of the recent "restorations" are in reality) especially since the tooling used to build the new wings for these P-51's can be spread out over multiple aircraft. With only 3-4 flyable/potentially flyable B-29's, you can't make the same argument for that kind of investment. As it is, it's likely that none of FiFi's engines (and Doc's as well) will ever require overhaul prior to the airframes being grounded because the new hybrids on the airframes have 1000hr+ Time Between Overhaul and only about 1000 hours left on the airframes. The original engines had a TBO, even with great care, of 75-100 hours.
There is a practical and financial limit to everything. At some point, it just simply isn't worth doing. That's where you're at with Kee Bird.
There is a practical and financial limit to everything. At some point, it just simply isn't worth doing. That's where you're at with Kee Bird.
- cflord
- Chief Master Sergeant
- Posts: 2744
- Joined: 30 Dec 2004, 17:07
- Location: Powder Springs, Georgia USA
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
A few movie clips of Doc's recovery, restoration, and engine delivery:
Rescuing Doc from China Lake:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnTJPTuGkMU
Doc at Boeing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlOjExDHww4
Doc’s engine arrives:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TY3lQBiJaPQ
Keep the shiny side up and the dirty side down!
Ret SMSgt Cliff Lord - C-130 Flight Engineer & Mechanic
Rescuing Doc from China Lake:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gnTJPTuGkMU
Doc at Boeing:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlOjExDHww4
Doc’s engine arrives:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TY3lQBiJaPQ
Keep the shiny side up and the dirty side down!
Ret SMSgt Cliff Lord - C-130 Flight Engineer & Mechanic
Re: Hopes high that restored B-29 ‘Doc’ will fly in 2014
Cap thank you for the explanation and learned something new about the airframe life thank you. Watched and enjoyed the videos brings up a couple of questions. . I did not now that Boeing had a division in Wichita, KS. Assumed that Boeing was at Tacoma, WA only. Didn't Boeing move from some place? To Tacoma to build ships originaly and as the war broke out started building aircraft? Sorry off topic? Did they build some of the B-17s & B-29s in Wichita? Packard in Detroit built Merlins for marine and airplane engines. Need to do more historical research.
Who is online
Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 29 guests