Elevator Reversed?

[bw_wolverine]

I've spent the last long while searching for some other mention of this but I can't find any.

Is it just me or is my elevator reversed when I'm in cockpit view. I mean the physical elevator.

Using TrackIR when I look over my shoulder to see roughly 7 o'clock or 5 o'clock I can see the elevator. Only when I pull UP the elevator DROPS as if I'm pushing the stick forward. When I push the stick forward, the elevator lifts up as if I'm pulling back. This is in the Hurricane airframe.

Just tested the rest.

109 model the elevator doesn't even move if you view it from the cockpit. Also you can't see the tail rudder at all. It's just missing.

The 110 model seems like it's missing the rear half of the plane.

Seems very strange. Anyway, just thought I'd point it out in case its one of those rare things that people somehow miss. The missing parts I can understand if the model wasn't designed with TrackIR in mind, but the elevator moving opposite the input is very strange.

[MadRobbie1]

Hi Wolverine, welcome to BoBII

Interesting find - would like to check it out myself but got a few questions for you. I don't have TIR (mouse & joystick hat for me!), so I can see if it's an issue created by the operation of this device or if its potentially throughout.

Have you tested all the available aircraft, Spitfire, Hurricane, Me110, Me109 and Ju87?
What are the Field of View angles you're using - what the values you have set in the options menu, and what state of zoom are you using in the views?
And, is the issue apparent in both internal and external views?

Last to confirm, is this just an animation issue where the visual result does not correspond to the physical input - or is it an actual control issue where the physical axis on your controller is reversed thus affecting the way the aircraft fly?

Cheers!
Rob

CPS_Bomber

[MadRobbie1]

I've spent the last long while searching for some other mention of this but I can't find any.
Is it just me or is my elevator reversed when I'm in cockpit view. I mean the physical elevator.
Using TrackIR when I look over my shoulder to see roughly 7 o'clock or 5 o'clock I can see the elevator. Only when I pull UP the elevator DROPS as if I'm pushing the stick forward. When I push the stick forward, the elevator lifts up as if I'm pulling back. This is in the Hurricane airframe.
Just tested the rest.
109 model the elevator doesn't even move if you view it from the cockpit. Also you can't see the tail rudder at all. It's just missing.
The 110 model seems like it's missing the rear half of the plane.
Seems very strange. Anyway, just thought I'd point it out in case its one of those rare things that people somehow miss. The missing parts I can understand if the model wasn't designed with TrackIR in mind, but the elevator moving opposite the input is very strange.

Just tested this out. As mentioned above, I don't have TrackIR, so manual views for me.

Firstly, my FoV settings:

SMALL: 25
MEDIUM: 50
LARGE: 80
SMALL TOGGLE: 35
LARGE TOGGLE: 70
MAXIMUM: 100
MINIMUM: 18
INITIAL: 80
PADLOCK HDG: 10
PADLOCK PITCH: 10


SPITFIRE: nothing of the rear of the aircraft seen out of the cockpit behind the rear bulkhead when looking over the shoulder, either when sitting normally or leaning over to the side.

HURRICANE: nothing of the rear of the aircraft seen out of the cockpit behind the rear bulkhead when looking over the shoulder except the radio mast. When leaning to the side, you can see the tailplane and the elevators. The elevators move in the opposite direction to the pitch control input, however the physical movement of the aircraft is as should be. The animation of the elevators is also offset on the horizontal at an angle to the hinge, I would say roughly 25-30degrees, resulting in the effect that the elevator gets higher towards the fuselage as it travels.

Me109: radio mast visible when looking over the shoulder. The tailplane tips can also be seen, but there are no animations of the control surfaces.

Me110: as Wolverine states above, the entire rear section of the 110 is missing from the Bordfunker's rear bulkhead backwards.

Ju87: nothing of the rear of the aircraft seen out of the cockpit behind the rear bulkhead when looking over the shoulder. When leaning over to the side the port tailplane can be seen but the starboard one cannot. There are no animations visible for the elevator.


Over to you Buddye
Is there something that can be done with any of this?

Cheers!
Rob


CPS_Bomber

[bw_wolverine]

I can confirm everything in the above post.

It's simply an animation issue as far as I can see. I thought it might be a case of the model designer not considering the field of view created by TrackIR (as is the case with IL-2 models when the 6dof mod is used) but since you're not using TrackIR...

Definitely takes away from the immersion of the sim for me :/ The cockpits are otherwise wonderful (I prefer these cockpits to the IL-2 ones for sure).

[MadRobbie1]

What we have to remember is that the basic bones of BoBII is still from the old Rowan Battle of Britain - something that was built way before the like of TIR came on the scene.... the interior models weren't built with the freedom of TIR in mind. Maybe something can be done in the future..? We need the likes of Buddye to comment on this detail though.


Cheers!
Rob


CPS_Bomber

[Buddye]

Well, this is the first I have ever heard of this bug (I guess we will always have new bugs). The control surface animations will be a big issue as I have no knowledge of how they work or how they were implemented.

TrackIR was a BOBII add-on so I guess Rowan had little need or interest in the tail surface animations.

I will add it to my bug list to be investigated but I do not think I can address it without other skills.

[Osram]

This must an issue in the cockpit 3D models.
So we would need to find and tweak the 3D model "source" and then "recompile" it into an in-game-model. That is an issue since most original 3D modellers moved on to other things. Unfortunately I see no way we coders can work around this issue; If we would invert the value for some cockpit, this would invert the workings of the control column as well, which would certainly be worse than the bad elevator animation in cockpit.

[blue six]

I expect Simon could fix the reversed animation for us very quickly, provided he had access to the cockpit 3D model. Is anyone still in touch with him?

blue six