What Have You Done ?!? Update is Not Cool !

[Eric Bakker]

Eric, try one of the other AA setting if its unable to provide you with performance when using the new features of the platform. Remember that SSAA is a super high end AA process in which you are rendering things 4 times more than normal to get the result you see on screen. Its a known performance hog compared to other methods so tends to be used sparingly, and esp going to be hard on the newer things as Lockheed introduces more and more modern workflows onto the platform.

Hi Lewis,

Thank you for your advice. I understand what you say, but SSAA is running smoothly in P3D (I get 60 fps), so there is no need to switch to another AA setting. The only culprit is using the light of the Glareshield. So until A2A found a solution for that, I will just not use the Glareshield light in the C172.
Also, please refrain from updating the other A2A aircraft same way, unless you also still provide a version without the Glareshield update, so we have a choice what to install.

[Lewis - A2A]

Hey Eric, I understand it has run fine but if it doesn't run fine when its features are being used then it doesn't run fine. For example its like saying FSX runs fine with low res textures enabled in the settings. Its not technically running fine as you're running with the handicap of not using a key feature of that platform, at the time 2006 was the higher res VC textures.

The guys are working on trying to help reduce the impact but wanted to make everyone aware of what the high end AA is doing in order to produce the look, manage the expectations as things progress here and or on other platforms, why that particular type of AA use will almost always result in settings changes and compromises whenever large new graphical features are added. In this case the P3D platforms Dynamic lighting features.

thanks,
Lewis

[Eric Bakker]

Lewis, if I use MSAA instead of SSAA the overal quality of the graphics is less attractive to me (I run 1920x1080, I imagine that with 4K the difference is less).
So if I have to choose between a poorer picture all of time or not use the Glareshield light, it is an easy choice for the latter.
I fly by day most of the time anyway

[MarcE]

Okay, thanks Marc - interested to hear how you get on later.
Thanks,
Nick

Hi Nick,

well, to be fair with A2A, I don't think my bad performance using the PBR model has anything to do with you. It might be true that it only happens with the C172 PBR right now, I am too frustrated right now to do some tests. I've just found that for some reason my P3D has obviously totally been messed up. All of my Axes and button assignments have been reset to default although I had everything deleted and use FSUIPC and LINDA. My FS2Crew for FSLabs and PMDG don't work anymore, My NVIDIA control panel settings have been reset to default.. I'm so sick of these fu*** windows updates (obviously I had one last night). I'm so sick of that old P3D/FSX cra*, I'm so tired of constantly fighting against that da*n Redmont entertai... PAIN business.. I guess I'll take a nap from P3D for a few days, play some snooker and regain my attitude before I try to fix their mess. again...

Thanks for your effort anyway!

And sorry for the bad language.

See you

[MarcE]

Lewis, if I use MSAA instead of SSAA the overal quality of the graphics is less attractive to me (I run 1920x1080, I imagine that with 4K the difference is less).
So if I have to choose between a poorer picture all of time or not use the Glareshield light, it is an easy choice for the latter.
I fly by day most of the time anyway

Eric,


you have a GTX 1070, you can deal with MSAA8x very well... go to your NVIDIA control panel , manage 3D settings, right side Program settings, choose P3D to customize, set optimize for performance whereever you can and set "Antialiasing - Transparency" to Multisample or a slightly higher value than in P3D. play around with the settings (I THINK you need to restart P3D after you changed something.) This makes the GPU render better pictures outside of the sim and relieves P3D significantly.

I have written about my normal setting here https://forum.pmdg.com/forum/main-forum ... #post36422 if you want to read about it.. It's a mix of my personal observations over the years and of things I've read in other forums.. Maybe it helps a bit.

[Gabe777]

I have seen the thread about SSAA and it is not relevant to me. I use 4xMSAA and just 1 notch of glareshield lighting drops FPS by 2 thirds. Turn off AA completely, and its fine. But noone runs this sim with no AA. That's absurd.

Gabe - there should be a negligible FPS impact from using MSAA in conjunction with dynamic lighting. I can run 8xMSAA and the FPS is essentially unchanged, regardless of how many dynamic lights are switched on. Hard to tell what could be causing the performance drop on your system, but do you have shader mods or anything like that installed?

Also, what GPU and display resolution are you using, and what are the FPS number you're seeing? This is a FPS comparison with my installation as described above.


8xMSAA - All lights off: average FPS = 111.3


8xMSAA - All dynamic lights on: average FPS = 109.6

Thanks,
Nick
[/quote]

Could be the 4xSGSS I have in nVidia inspector. I have a profile that matches it with 4xMSAA in-sim. This gives best performance/AA solution for 3D clouds with Active Sky.

Will try tomorrow but will still be unusable for me, as I cannot reduce AA by any more.

It could be a wierd interaction between SFSS and your dynamic glareshield lights.
......But how come the external lights are just fine ? Something doesn't add up, but I intend to get to its bottom !

I love the external lights and the PBR is off the charts, but the glareshield lets it down for me, and the fact that the instrument lights won't come on unless it's night... is the latter intentional ?

[Gabe777]

Okay, thanks Marc - interested to hear how you get on later.
Thanks,
Nick

Hi Nick,

well, to be fair with A2A, I don't think my bad performance using the PBR model has anything to do with you. It might be true that it only happens with the C172 PBR right now, I am too frustrated right now to do some tests. I've just found that for some reason my P3D has obviously totally been messed up. All of my Axes and button assignments have been reset to default although I had everything deleted and use FSUIPC and LINDA. My FS2Crew for FSLabs and PMDG don't work anymore, My NVIDIA control panel settings have been reset to default.. I'm so sick of these fu*** windows updates (obviously I had one last night). I'm so sick of that old P3D/FSX cra*, I'm so tired of constantly fighting against that da*n Redmont entertai... PAIN business.. I guess I'll take a nap from P3D for a few days, play some snooker and regain my attitude before I try to fix their mess. again...

Thanks for your effort anyway!

And sorry for the bad language.

See you

You should get Win 10 Pro and use Group Policy to disable updates, especially drivers.

Alternatively use OOShutUpWindows and disable auto updates and driver updates.

I feel your pain though. Really !

I was cussing Microsoft a lot earlier. I have vowed never to buy into FS2020, and am actually planning to get more stuff for both P3D and X plane at Xmas... despite having Tech Alpha 1.
(Not missing much to be honest ! )

[Eric Bakker]

you have a GTX 1070, you can deal with MSAA8x very well... go to your NVIDIA control panel , manage 3D settings, right side Program settings, choose P3D to customize, set optimize for performance whereever you can and set "Antialiasing - Transparency" to Multisample or a slightly higher value than in P3D. play around with the settings (I THINK you need to restart P3D after you changed something.) This makes the GPU render better pictures outside of the sim and relieves P3D significantly.

Thanks Marc, I will have a look at that, although after many years of tinkering with NVIDIA Inspector I lately try to stick just to what P3D itself can offer me.

[MarcE]

Nick,

the issues I saw regarding the performance are gone. I had the win update reset my NVIDIA driver to an older version and reactivate the HD Sounds in the background which I deactivated a long time ago because they absolutely brought down my 1080TI. I'm back to normal now and see no significant loss anymore. However I hope you'll be able to improve the experience for the others too.

Gabe, sorry for the harsh words. And thanks for that tip, I'll have a look at this shutup thing..

[Nick - A2A]

Nick,

the issues I saw regarding the performance are gone. I had the win update reset my NVIDIA driver to an older version and reactivate the HD Sounds in the background which I deactivated a long time ago because they absolutely brought down my 1080TI. I'm back to normal now and see no significant loss anymore. However I hope you'll be able to improve the experience for the others too.

Thanks for the update Marc and good to hear the performance issue seems to be resolved on your system. As mentioned earlier, I don't think PBR itself should have too much of a performance penalty, at least given a fairly recent GPU.

As regards the FPS impact caused by dynamic lighting in conjunction with SSAA, we've just released an update which gives an aircraft configurator option to address this. More info here.

Cheers,
Nick