Slingsby Gliders

Battle of Britain "Wings of Victory"
Osram
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Slingsby Gliders

Post by Osram »

Tako_Kichi wrote in another thread:

I also have many more hours logged in RAF Slingsby gliders and my scariest ever flight was in one but that's another story! Wink
Tell us more, tell us more! :D
When you wrote about the Chipmunk, I thouhgt "I have to ask what ohter craft he flew, maybe there is even a Slingsby among them!"
It is one of my favorite WWII craft, when bob-ma was still around (sniff!) my avatar on there was one :D

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Tako_Kichi
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Re: Slingsby Gliders

Post by Tako_Kichi »

Osram wrote:Tako_Kichi wrote in another thread:

I also have many more hours logged in RAF Slingsby gliders and my scariest ever flight was in one but that's another story! Wink
Tell us more, tell us more! :D
When you wrote about the Chipmunk, I thouhgt "I have to ask what ohter craft he flew, maybe there is even a Slingsby among them!"
It is one of my favorite WWII craft, when bob-ma was still around (sniff!) my avatar on there was one :D
LOL...well it is going to take me a while to write it up as I am going to have to dig in the memory banks for those memories from 35 years ago (Jeez is it really that long since I flew in a Slingsby :shock: ). I am going to have to trawl the net to see if I can come up with some images too. I know we flew two types, one a tandem model and one a side-by-side model but I cannot remember the mark or model numbers off the top of my head.

Watch this space Osram I will be back....maybe sometime late tomorrow :wink: .

EDIT: After a quick dash through Google I can confirm that the tandem model was a T.31B and the side-by-side model was a T.21. I found a few links for the T.21 but very little for the T.31B (lots for the T.7/8 single seat variant though). I will post links to what I found in my report....lol.
Last edited by Tako_Kichi on 30 Jul 2006, 21:39, edited 1 time in total.
Larry
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Post by Tako_Kichi »

Osram asked me to relate this tale so I hope a few of you will find it interesting and maybe even a little amusing. Sorry if it gets a bit long but I wanted to add a bit of background information :wink: .

Background Info
Way back at the beginning of the 70's I was a member of 435 Sqdn ATC (Air Training Corps) the RAF's cadet force. As well as the typical military cadet fare of drill (square bashing), weapons training, assault courses and route marches Air Cadets also got a chance to go flying at RAF bases several times a year. The primary powered trainer of the period was the DeHavilland Chipmunk (like the one in my avatar) and I had lots of flights in these wonderfully docile tail-draggers. The thrill of doing aerobatics all over the sky when you were just 13-14 years old was unbelievable and I used to relish every flight. To supplement the powered flight experience we also went gliding and as the nearest glider equipped RAF base was only 16 miles away from our HQ we were able to go gliding far more frequently than we did power flying. As time went on I found I enjoyed gliding more than powered flight, partly because we flew gliders more often, partly for the serene beauty of floating around in almost total silence with just the 'whistle' of the wind over the wings and partly because once I started on the glider training course I got to sit in the front seat instead of the back :wink: .

The first glider flights I had were what were known as Air Experience Flights and these were undertaken in the beautiful Slingsby T.21 (Type 21). The pilot and cadet sat side-by-side in an open cockpit and each was able to watch the actions of the other as all the controls were duplicated. Just like when I went powered flying once we were airborne and stable the pilot handed control to me and I was flying the aircraft on my first glider flight, a truly amazing feeling! I flew the T.21 on many occasions after that and loved every minute of it and even progressed to doing take offs and landings.

I have Googled up a few links to images of the T.21 so you can see what this wide bodied lady looked like.

http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.s ... entry=true
http://www.lasham.org.uk/news/articles/T21/t21.html
http://www.mugshots-uk.co.uk/Photograph ... hings.html
http://www.sailplanedirectory.com/slingsb.htm


As time progressed and I aged (LOL) I became eligible to enrol on the glider proficiency course. You had to be at least 15 years old to enrol as the idea was that you should turn 16 just before the end of the second half of the course. The reasoning behind this was the ultimate goal of achieving your first 'solo' glider flight. You had to be 16 years old to do that and once completed you could apply for a Civilian Glider Pilot's Licence. There was also a change in the gliders we flew. No longer would we be sitting beside the pilot but we would be in a 'tandem' glider with the instructor in the back and we got to sit in the front seat! The T.21s were by no means new when we were flying them as they had been around for a number of years but the Slingsby T.31Bs we were going to fly on the course were positively ancient! They were nearing the end of their service life when I flew them and it was very obvious from the numerous patches on the wings and fuselage! The mark originally flew in 1949 and 131 examples were flown by the ATC. The flying controls were extremely basic and consisted of just a joystick, rudder pedals and a lever that operated the 'spoilers' used in landing. The cockpit gauges were spartan to say the least and had an altimeter, air speed indicator and a glass tube with a bead in it that was supposed to indicate if you were in a lift or sink situation (the instructor in the back seat had some additional instruments that included a compass and an improved rate of climb/descent indicator amongst others). The only other thing on the cockpit front panel was a large, yellow, wooden ball the size of a pool ball that was attached to a steel cable. The other end of the cable was attached to the tow cable release mechanism and this device features large in the tale I will relate below! Oh, by the way, all RAF gliders were flown WITHOUT the benefit of a parachute as these were considered to be too heavy and all cadets had to be weighed before starting flight ops for the day and those over a certain weight had a ribbon pinned to their uniform so that the instructor knew he had to change the nose ballast weight to a smaller one in those cases!

Unfortunately there seems to be very little information available on the net for the T.31B but I have included a few links below that show either the T.31B or the single seat predecessors the T.7/8 and there are some shots of the cockpits.

http://www.airliners.net/search/photo.s ... entry=true
http://homepage.ntlworld.com/markansell ... iders.html
http://www.vintagesailplane.org/winners.shtml
http://www.sailplanedirectory.com/Plane ... laneID=364

The scariest flight of my life!
I had already taken part in a couple of training days on the gliding course and was eagerly awaiting the next one but as winter was approaching I realized that I would have to wait until the spring before the training could continue. Imagine my surprise when the CO came into the training room one evening and pinned a notice up on the notice board and announced the next gliding course dates were out. There was a mad scramble to the board as soon as we had been dismissed as all those on the course tried to see when the dates had been set for. There was a loud groan from those nearest the board when they discovered that the first date had been set for the second Saturday in January! We were going to have to fly open cockpit gliders in the depths of an English winter! BRRRR!!!!

The appointed day duly arrived and we assembled at the HQ and awaited the arrival of the RAF transport to take us to RAF Tern Hill. The transport turned out to be a ram-shackled old bus that the heating system had broken down on and the seats were like iron. We arrived at the base like a package of frozen chips/fries! We did get a brief period to warm up during the pre-flight briefing when we were given the usual safety talks and the Met boys gave us a rundown on the day's weather conditions and then we were put into the back of a three ton truck and taken out to the field.

The gliders had already been towed into position at the downwind end of the field and the trucks with the winches mounted on the back were in position half way down the field instead of giving us the full length of cable available. We had a ceiling of 1,500 feet that day due to a low overcast so flights were only going to be 8-12 minutes in length, just enough for a single circuit and the landing approach. The winch trucks had been brought up the field in order to limit the amount of height we could get and to keep us out of the clouds. We jumped out of the truck and got ready for the first flight. There were three T.31Bs available that day and more than a dozen cadets so there would be long periods between the short flights. Luckily there were things to do on the ground like acting as the wing-tip man to hold the wing down while the glider was stationary and then running alongside the glider with the wing tip held at head height until the pilot had enough speed to be able to hold the wings level, operating the hand-held Aldis lamp that was used to signal instructions to the winch crew or riding 'shotgun' on the Land Rover that was used to retrieve the dropped tow cables and haul them back to the launch area. All the time we were out on the field the cold was biting at us as we were wearing the standard issue ATC woollen battledress of the time which was actually ex-RAF gear from just after WWII and knee length ex-RAF greatcoats (I still remember that the Ministry of Defence label in mine had the first issued date of 1945!)

The first couple of flights I had were chilly but no big problem. On the third flight I hit a snow squall just after dropping the cable and by the time I landed I looked like a snowman from the front as all the snow had stuck to my already frozen clothing! Flying in snow in an open cockpit glider is not the most enjoyable thing I can think of! Thankfully it was just a quick squall and did not curtail the flying activities for long but things were going to get a whole lot trickier on the next flight!

By the time my next flight came around I was really feeling the effects of the cold. I was shivering from head to foot and my hands and feet felt like solid blocks of ice. I ran over to the glider after it landed and had been pushed back to the 'start line' and switched places with the cadet getting out after handing my pocket log book to the instructor and strapped in. While this was happening the tow cable had been attached to the hook under the nose of the glider. I was at the point in the course where I was in charge of the glider from the moment I climbed in to the moment I climbed out so I told the guy on the wing tip to hold it up and I went through the pre-flight checks. There was actually very little to check on these old gliders and it was basically a case of waggling the controls to make sure the bits that should move did and the bits that shouldn't move didn't! :wink: With the checks over it was time for a good look above and behind to check where the other gliders were and we were clear to take off.

I gave the order to 'take up slack' and the cadet on the Aldis lamp started sending slow flashes to the winch crew. The blinking light in the distance told me the crew had responded and the slack in the cable was being wound in. I watched the cable snaking across the grass in front of me and as soon as it went tight I shouted "All out" and the signaller started sending rapid flashes to the winch crew. A second later I saw a puff of black smoke go up from the diesel engine on the winch as the operator gave it full throttle and we were off! After a very brief period of noise and shaking as we bounced across the grass the old bird lifted off and all was silent save for the rush of wind over the wings. I eased the stick back until we were at the correct climb angle and then centred the stick and sat back to enjoy the elevator ride to the top.

All too soon we were at the top and I felt the typical 'nose bounce' that told me we were as high as we were going to get and it was time to drop the tow cable before the winch started pulling us out of the sky again. It was at this point the flight went to hell in a hand basket! I don't know if it was the effects of the cold or if I just had a mental freeze-up but I committed the ultimate sin when it comes to winch launches in a T.31B! Throughout all our training we had repeatedly been told that when it comes time to drop the cable we MUST push the stick all the way forward BEFORE we drop the cable to compensate for the effects of the cable drop as the sudden release of pressure on the nose WILL cause adverse affects on the glider if it is not in a nose down attitude!

Well there I was, frozen stiff with numb hands and feet and my mind a total blank when I felt the nose bounce so I reached for the big yellow ball hanging out of the dash and gave it a good old tug to drop the cable. I was instantly compressed into the seat and the nose of the glider catapulted upwards until the aircraft was sitting absolutely vertical and starting to fall earthwards in a tail down attitude! Yup, I had forgotten to push the stick forward BEFORE dropping the cable and I was now experiencing first hand what all the instructors had been warning us about! I was not feeling any effects of the cold at that point as I was now sweating profusely but my mind was still a blank as I sat there in a cloud of steam and the wind whistled past my ears going IN THE WRONG DIRECTION!

A bellow of "WELL F@$%#&* DO SOMETHING THEN!!!" from the back seat snapped me out of it and in a blind panic I worked the rudder pedals like a cyclist in the Tour de France and whipped the stick around as if I was trying to stir paint in a 5 gallon bucket! After what seemed like eons, but was probably only a couple of seconds, the port wing tip started to drop and the nose followed it. A second later and I was still dropping vertically out of the sky but this time I was nose down and I knew what to do about that! I waited one more second to build up airspeed and then pulled back on the stick and the old girl picked her nose up and settled into level flight .... PHEW!!! The only problem now was that I was heading off at 90° to the take off line and a quick glance at the altimeter told me I was 500 feet lower than I should have been! I had lost 500 feet (or a third of my total height) while trying to sort out my tail first plummet!

I quickly asked the instructor what I should do as we did not have enough altitude to complete the 'regular' circuit and he told me to immediately turn 90° to port and follow the airfield perimeter fence to the road (in effect shortening the cross-wind leg) and once we were over the farmer's field on the other side of the road we could do a 180 and make a short approach landing. If we lost too much height in the turn we could put down in the farmer's field and the cows currently grazing in said field would just have to get out of the damn way!

As it happened I was able to make the 180 without losing too much height but I swear that when we crossed the airfield perimeter fence there was less than 30 feet between the bottom of the glider and the telephone wires along the edge of the road! As soon as I crossed the fence I popped up the spoilers to slow the plane and reduce the lift from the wing and she settled softly onto the ground effect cushion at about 10 feet from the ground and then gently sank the rest of the way into a perfect no-bounce landing! At least I got that bit right! Within 40-50 yards we had rattled to a halt and I pushed the stick hard over to drop the wing tip onto the ground. The recovery crew were right there as soon as we stopped rolling and we were wheeled back to the 'start line'.

I unstrapped and clambered out and when I turned to look at the instructor he was sitting there as calm as could be, twiddling with the windswept waxed tips of his handlebar moustache with one hand while he filled in my log book record with the other. He looked up at me with a grin on his face like the proverbial Cheshire Cat and quietly said "Well done, you at least got us back to the ground in one piece!" and then in a parade ground bellow that I am sure was heard at the winches halfway down the field he roared "BUT DON'T EVER F@$%#&* DO THAT AGAIN!!!!!" I threw him a rather shaky salute and mumbled 'Yessir, nosir, thankyousir" and wobbled my way back to rest of the crew on very shaky legs.

I was immediately surrounded and bombarded with all sorts of questions about what went wrong but thankfully the arrival of the NAAFI truck bearing sticky buns and giant enamel mugs of hot, sweet, tea quickly diverted their attention. As I sat on the bumper of the NAAFI truck a few minutes later with my frozen hands wrapped around the mug of warming nectar I suddenly realized something that sent a warm glow right through my cold body. Not once during that entire flight had I felt the instructors hands or feet on the controls! He had sat in the back and let me get on with it and never attempted to take control of the aircraft at any point in the flight. I put us in that difficult situation and I got us out of it again and back on the ground in one piece! Not bad for a 15 year old kid who was still in school!

It was a lesson learned the hard way but it is a lesson I have never forgotten and I bet if I were to climb into a T.31B today I would damn well remember to ram that stick forward BEFORE I pulled the bloody release cable! :wink:
Larry
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Buddye
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Post by Buddye »

Larry,

A great read and very interseting. I really enjoyed reading it. Reminds me of my youth when my Dad, me, and my brothers completely rebulit a 1938 Luscome and few it for years until it was totally destroyed in a tornado. I never fly again after that and actually never wanted to.
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OllieC-FWOL
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Post by OllieC-FWOL »

Very good story, thanks for sharing.

8)

Jwcfly
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Post by Jwcfly »

For those that have FS9, Rick Piper made an excellent T-21B, and there are also some repaints. On Avsim, search "Slingsby" (no quotes). I'm not a pilot, and have flown it little, so can't comment on accuracy, but Mr. Piper does great work.
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Osram
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Post by Osram »

Great story :D!
Sorry I react only now, I am currently in super panic mode as I try to get amap (as much as possble) done of what needs doing :///.

I need to quiz you more later.

I have been in ATC as well, but for us it meant Air traffic Control :lol: and we had no Gliders :(.

It's surprising how stupid you can become if you are focused on something else and then need to think fast and hard :/. Hanggliding I once forgot whether to land with or against the windsock and could not even deduce it in the hectic :roll: The funny thing is the pupil behind me just followed me and landed the wrong way as well :lol:

I am surprised that you did not get parachutes. For us it was mandantory for flights that reach 50 meters above ground. This is the official height they work at, although quite a few people successfully used them from 30 meters upwards. BTW it seems this height is not so much different to 60+ years ago as a WWII parachute soldier once told me he jumped from below 100 meters and there was no danger at all. That must have been in 1944 or even 1945 so I wonder that there was no danger to their Ju52 being shotdown, but oh well. Seems the fighting on the ground was so brutal that the danger of being shot down in a transport did not touch him.

The "snow" stuff reminds me of one of my more memorable landings (as a passenger even). I took some training in the US, as in Florida they have great weather 365 days a year and the "flying park" concept means it is open almost 365 days a year. When I arrived I found out the 2 weeks beforehand it had been raining so much there had been almost no flying :roll: On the weekends there are more pupils, as some people living not too far away work under the week and go flying on the weekend :). So there are one or two instructors that only instruct on the weekend. I had a fairly uneventful ride with one, flying apart from T/O and landing. Of course the instructor touched ground beautifully with the double seater, but after a second or two a shshshsh sound appeared and all the world around us started to look blurry :shock: . As you might have guessed by now, we had touched down just in front of a patch that was completely soaked, actually the water level was above the earth but below the tips of the grass and it was very hard to see from the air and the instructor had not known about it. We were soaked :lol: This was a hangglider with wheels attached so there was no "wall" at all, I could have reached the side wheels with my outstrecthed hands.

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Tako_Kichi
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Post by Tako_Kichi »

Osram wrote:Great story :D!
Sorry I react only now, I am currently in super panic mode as I try to get amap (as much as possble) done of what needs doing :///.

I need to quiz you more later.
OH OH! :lol: I hope I will have answers for you :wink: .
Osram wrote:I have been in ATC as well, but for us it meant Air traffic Control :lol: and we had no Gliders :(.
Interesting, when I first emigrated to Canada I couldn't find work in my field as my College Lecturer qualifications were not recognised in Ontario so I enrolled on a correspondence course that was supposed to bring you up to the entry exam level to be a Canadian ATC. After spending a couple of months sweating over the books and trying to do the complex math in my head in the time available for each question I realised that being an ATC was not the best career choice for me!

Osram wrote:I am surprised that you did not get parachutes.
I think the 'powers that be' had decided that they were 'unnecessary' as gliders were supposed to fly without an engine so you would always be able to glide back to earth! What we were supposed to do in the case of a catastrophic airframe failure is anyone's guess. Flap our arms really hard like a bird I guess! The weight was another factor as I said before but they didn't even issue flying goggles either! Things were different back in the 70's I guess as there was a lot of the 'if it was good enough for me when I was your age it's good enough for you now' attitude going on.
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242Sqn_Cat
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Post by 242Sqn_Cat »

Great story! Brought back many memories of my time in the ATC, also in the early seventies. Your descriptions of the controls and launch reminded me of many things that I'd forgotten. I never had such a scary flight as you but do remember spending what seemed like an eternity in cloud above West Malling. No sense of motion other than the wind in my face and the noise of it; desperately hoping that I was still the right way up!

Cheers!

BattlerBritain
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Post by BattlerBritain »

Same here, only my flights were done from Kenley in December, around 1978 IIRC.

God it was cold!!

Like Brighton in mid-summer :D

Take-offs were interesting - a bit like getting dragged up the start-up ramp of a giant helter-skelter, only with a very gentle drop-off the other side. The piece and quiet when the cable dropped off was amazing.

I remember the wooden seat, the flimsy plastic wind-screen which didn't keep the rain out, the bits of wood that made up the cockpit wall and trying not to squeeze them too hard in case my fingers pierced the canvas that was wrapped round them.

They don't make 'em like that any more!

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Tako_Kichi
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Post by Tako_Kichi »

BattlerBritain wrote:They don't make 'em like that any more!
SNIFF! :cry: I know, and tell the kids of today about it and they don't believe ya!

That's it, after that last comment I am now officially an 'old grumpy' LOL.
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Wheelie
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Post by Wheelie »

My ATC gliding time was spent in Sedburgs and Kirby Cadets at RAF Locking. Apart from a memorable stall when we abandoned the winch a bit prematurely, and the time when the pilot tapped the instrument panel and one of the dials fell out, my over-riding memories are...

a) "I'm 14 - do you REALLY want me to take control"???
b) Standing on the damn wing for 8 hours to get 15 minutes of flight

Cheers

Nick

Osram
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Post by Osram »

Wheelie wrote:My ATC gliding time was spent in Sedburgs and Kirby Cadets at RAF Locking. Apart from a memorable stall when we abandoned the winch a bit prematurely, and the time when the pilot tapped the instrument panel and one of the dials fell out, my over-riding memories are...
Hm - one almost gets the feeling these ATC flights were pretty uneventful ??
b) Standing on the damn wing for 8 hours to get 15 minutes of flight
Yes, hanggliding is roughly the same :-/. Drive to friends where the glider is, get it onto the car roof, drive to site, speak to others, wait for weather, setup, wait for weather etc, take off, land, break down, somehow catch a ride up, catch car and drive down, put glider onto roof, check whether there is time for another 5 minute ride :-/.

OTOH with the rubber launched original primary gliders it was even worse, they needed 13 guys to get one guy into the air. I once spoke to an old gent that had been involved and unfortunately most of the time was just part of the 13 and was the one only exactly once!


Wheelie
Location: Bristol, UK
Bristol ?? Isn't that this place near Chipping Sodbury ? :P :lol:
I have been there on pupils exchange, being from Hannover, oops, Hanover ;).

BTW do you know the "BGGC - The Bristol and Gloucestershire Gliding Club" ? Here is a tale abpout a Slingsby Grasshopper - the Slingsby I at first thought about when Tako mentioned one:

http://www.bggc.co.uk/members/severn_sk ... r_2001.htm

MurrayCod
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Post by MurrayCod »

thanks for sharing your story. I've only ever had one glider flight (Tocumwal, Australia), but it was the most magnificent flight. Blue sky, warm sun, few clouds and just the sound of the air rushing past. :D

Wheelie
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Post by Wheelie »


Bristol ?? Isn't that this place near Chipping Sodbury ? :P :lol:
I have been there on pupils exchange, being from Hannover, oops, Hanover ;).
Yep, fine fish and chip shop at Chipping Sodbury. Do you know that I'd never realised that Bristol and Hannover were twinned? The things you learn on this forum...
BTW do you know the "BGGC - The Bristol and Gloucestershire Gliding Club" ? Here is a tale abpout a Slingsby Grasshopper - the Slingsby I at first thought about when Tako mentioned one:
Nice story! Unfortunately my gliding days are over and have been replaced with child-rearing instead. And the now abandoned RAF Locking is certain to end up covered in houses and "Retail Parks". Who'd grow up, eh? :wink:

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