According to the link, the competition its trying to keep on fighting
http://forum.1cpublishing.eu/showthread.php?t=27848
COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
One only starts to live after seeing the Elephant.
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
good,it needs it.We also need it to keep a specialist genre alive.
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
It has garnered us a few more BoB recruits for sure. But interest peaked a few weeks after launch and just judging by Simhq traffic has halved in recent months as players fall away through frustration at unfixed issues (naff AI, broken radio commands, poor fps), plus, i suspect, the lack of US kites and theatres.
IL2 was a weirdo Russian niche sim until Just Flight opened it up to the world with the Battle Over Europe add on, which also added a dynamic campaign. The cash started to flow, Oleg saw the light and released the USAF heavy Aces Expansion pack. Then Pacific Fighters brought US simmers in droves.
While I am not complaining, as a BoB nut, I never understood why 1C would launch with the rather restricted BoB theatre, rather than going for the mass appeal potential of later war Europe where you can sell to the sentiment and preferences of flyers from Germany (FWs, Bf109G/K/210s or 262s), Russia (lend lease P39s, Yaks and IL2 redux), UK (Tempests, Mosquitos, Spit Vs, IXs and Lancasters), USA (B17s, P47s and P51s), and Italy in the Med (Reggianes and Macchis). You want to fly off carriers? Throw in a Malta map and the Ark Royal. Monty vs Rommel? Just include a desert map. It's so easy with late war Europe to include something for almost everyone.
How much time and effort did 1C lavish on the flyable Italian machines in Cliffs of Dover for the handful of simmers who fly them? I'd love to know how many units CoD has sold by featuring the 1940 Reggia Aeronautica vs what they could have sold in US and elsewhere with a few B26s, Mustangs or Jugs in their sim. I'm not saying US simmers are so narrowminded they only want to fly US machines (Buddye and Stickman are proof of that), but why narrow your audience to US simmers interested in UK and Axis types, when picking another theatre would open up the audience to the thousands of US simmers who do want to fly US machines as well? I'm Australian and IL2 really became a passion for me when I could fly RAAF Kittyhawks and Beaufighters over the Owen Stanley ranges in the battle for New Guinea campaign.
And if not late European theatre, then why not something like Korea, which hasn't been done since Mig Alley or Korean Combat Ace for CFS3. Korea gives you US Sabres, Panthers, B29s, Skyraiders, Banshees, F80s, Corsairs and UK Fleet Air Arm Fireflies, Seafires and Furies. Many think the PLAAF only fielded Mig15s but they also flew Soviet supplied Tu2s, La9s, Yak9s and IL10s. Korea would have been a much better choice for a theatre to kick off the next generation of IL2.
But what do I know? Obviously the best business model is to burn all your cash reserves in six years of development, then launch an unfinished buggy mess of a sim based on a niche theatre of war appealing to only half of the already limited simming public, then quit in a fit of pique, blame the publisher and disappear off the grid to raise pigs in Vladivostok.
IL2 was a weirdo Russian niche sim until Just Flight opened it up to the world with the Battle Over Europe add on, which also added a dynamic campaign. The cash started to flow, Oleg saw the light and released the USAF heavy Aces Expansion pack. Then Pacific Fighters brought US simmers in droves.
While I am not complaining, as a BoB nut, I never understood why 1C would launch with the rather restricted BoB theatre, rather than going for the mass appeal potential of later war Europe where you can sell to the sentiment and preferences of flyers from Germany (FWs, Bf109G/K/210s or 262s), Russia (lend lease P39s, Yaks and IL2 redux), UK (Tempests, Mosquitos, Spit Vs, IXs and Lancasters), USA (B17s, P47s and P51s), and Italy in the Med (Reggianes and Macchis). You want to fly off carriers? Throw in a Malta map and the Ark Royal. Monty vs Rommel? Just include a desert map. It's so easy with late war Europe to include something for almost everyone.
How much time and effort did 1C lavish on the flyable Italian machines in Cliffs of Dover for the handful of simmers who fly them? I'd love to know how many units CoD has sold by featuring the 1940 Reggia Aeronautica vs what they could have sold in US and elsewhere with a few B26s, Mustangs or Jugs in their sim. I'm not saying US simmers are so narrowminded they only want to fly US machines (Buddye and Stickman are proof of that), but why narrow your audience to US simmers interested in UK and Axis types, when picking another theatre would open up the audience to the thousands of US simmers who do want to fly US machines as well? I'm Australian and IL2 really became a passion for me when I could fly RAAF Kittyhawks and Beaufighters over the Owen Stanley ranges in the battle for New Guinea campaign.
And if not late European theatre, then why not something like Korea, which hasn't been done since Mig Alley or Korean Combat Ace for CFS3. Korea gives you US Sabres, Panthers, B29s, Skyraiders, Banshees, F80s, Corsairs and UK Fleet Air Arm Fireflies, Seafires and Furies. Many think the PLAAF only fielded Mig15s but they also flew Soviet supplied Tu2s, La9s, Yak9s and IL10s. Korea would have been a much better choice for a theatre to kick off the next generation of IL2.
But what do I know? Obviously the best business model is to burn all your cash reserves in six years of development, then launch an unfinished buggy mess of a sim based on a niche theatre of war appealing to only half of the already limited simming public, then quit in a fit of pique, blame the publisher and disappear off the grid to raise pigs in Vladivostok.
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
We saw Oleg at the flight sim show in the UK many years ago when this was first announced and the idea of BoB was because it is a small theatre of area that they can use to test and develop on before expanding on larger tasks.heinkill wrote: While I am not complaining, as a BoB nut, I never understood why 1C would launch with the rather restricted BoB theatre, rather than going for the mass appeal potential of later war Europe
Start small and learn.
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
The COD guys seem to be still working on some code issues. They are re-doing the graphics engine which is strange but they want to improve performance.
The AI is very poors and it will take years to become excellent (if ever). I think they are only working in areas that they have skill and knowledge.
The AI is very poors and it will take years to become excellent (if ever). I think they are only working in areas that they have skill and knowledge.
Buddye
Intel I7 920 4 core processor (2.66GHz, 8MB cache), 6GB DDR3 Triple Channel @1333MHz, 1.8GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 295, Sound Blaster X-Fi PCI Sound Card, Windows 7 Home Premium 64 Bit , CH Fighter Stick & Pedals ,TrackIR4 Pro
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Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
So, start small on Korea. Seriously. Same size theatre, mass appeal - multiple combatants, jets and props, fleet air ops, and a better chance of capturing players from the world's biggest sim market, USA. Academic though, too late, the damage may have been done.Trumper wrote: We saw Oleg at the flight sim show in the UK many years ago when this was first announced and the idea of BoB was because it is a small theatre of area that they can use to test and develop on before expanding on larger tasks.
Start small and learn.
In my industry (pharma) we have a saying learned through hard won experience - there is no such thing as a relaunch. You launch right, you win. You launch wrong, you lose. I see the gaming industry the same way.
Case in point: Uru: Ages Beyond Myst. The fourth game in the mega popular Myst series (similar situation to IL2 series). It was developed by Cyan Worlds shortly after 'Riven' was completed. The game took Cyan Worlds more than five years and $12 million to complete and it was a buggy dud (sound familiar?). It killed Cyan, contributing to the company's near collapse.
There are plenty of others. It is damn hard to come back from a dud launch, especially in the modern era where games are bought online, not in shops, based on online reviews. A peek at Metacritic shows 3 positive reviews, 6 mixed and 3 negative. The most common post by prospective players on the forums is 'should I buy?'.
It will be a fantastic comeback by 1C if a) they can bring another title to market from this series, and b) they can overcome the bad reputation this launch has given them. And I do love a great comeback story, which is why personally I have voted with my wallet and paid for two copies of Cliffs of Dover - my own little attempt to help them stay in the game. I'd encourage any sim lover to do the same because goodness knows we have so few true sim developers left.
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
Oh how true. I am amiss the prop flight sim genre is dying.
Last edited by PappyCain on 21 Nov 2011, 10:18, edited 2 times in total.
"Was it something I said?" - 'Moggy' Cattermole 'Piece of Cake'
Core 2 Duo E6700, ASUS P5N-E-SLI, 2GB Corsair DDR2 PC6400,ASUS Nvidia GeForce GTX 560Ti, Coolermaster 650W PSU and Case, Audigy 2ZS Platinum, 5.1 Z-640, XP Pro, 22" CHIMEI LCD
Core 2 Duo E6700, ASUS P5N-E-SLI, 2GB Corsair DDR2 PC6400,ASUS Nvidia GeForce GTX 560Ti, Coolermaster 650W PSU and Case, Audigy 2ZS Platinum, 5.1 Z-640, XP Pro, 22" CHIMEI LCD
- stalkervision
- Chief Master Sergeant
- Posts: 3308
- Joined: 02 Feb 2007, 12:14
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
I hate to say this about Il-2 and Cod.. but "what goes around comes around.."
I use to post nice BoB 2 screenies over on the Il-2 forums and was constantly ragged on and told how bad our game was and how dated it looked and just wait till COD came out how really bad it would be for our group here.
well they may have the graphics but not much more and STILL can't put the number of planes into the air that this game can and have it still flyable.
and you have to have a uber machine to even get that !
I use to post nice BoB 2 screenies over on the Il-2 forums and was constantly ragged on and told how bad our game was and how dated it looked and just wait till COD came out how really bad it would be for our group here.
well they may have the graphics but not much more and STILL can't put the number of planes into the air that this game can and have it still flyable.
and you have to have a uber machine to even get that !
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
Well, when in a doghfight one cannot have much time to look how gorgeous the terrain or other eye-candies there are around, one simple look for trouble and avoid being caught looking to the wrong side.
What matter is immersion, and BoB II has plenty of that
Still, I love flying for leisure over the BoB II terrain
What matter is immersion, and BoB II has plenty of that
Still, I love flying for leisure over the BoB II terrain
One only starts to live after seeing the Elephant.
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
So true SV. While I really don't want to see any sim developer go under for obvious reasons, the fanboy crew at most of the Il-2 CLoD forums are not so high and mighty now. Many, many times I had seen various well known Il-2 fanboys rip on WoV to no end. What really got under my skin was if anyone would ask about current and available BoB simulators, (of course WoV would come up) the bash fest would begin. From "avoid it because it's a buggy mess" to "save your money for Il-2 CLoD" were the usual responses. I just couldn't understand this reasoning at all since Il2 CLod (then SoW)was still years away, so what harm could it have possibly done to a yet unreleased Il2 CLoD to steer these people to WoV as at the very least as a placeholder for Il2 CLoD? I mean WoV wasn't expensive and would play very well on most newer PC's. The real crux of the matter came out if anyone really pressed the issue with these posters bashing WoV as to why they felt WoV was so bad that it was better to wait 2 to 3 years (or more) for CLoD then to play WoV now. Thats when you found out they either only played the original release or stopped playing WoV after the earliest upgrades (like 2.06 or earlier) or that since it wasn't Il-2 (or a spinoff) developed by Oleg Maddox and crew it just wasn't a "real flight sim" . Now these same guys feel we all should throw our total support behind CLoD and have total understanding while CLoD goes through it's "growing pains". Well okay fair enough, I bought my copy of Il-2 CLoD when it first came out, paid full price for it too. But my one question for them is where was the same "understanding" for WoV? I've said it before but IMHO I really think these guys were so stoked that Il-2 CLoD was going to kill WoV they couldn't contain themselfs, their mantra seems to be one developer for all WW2 flight sims (aka the Highlander Syndrome). If any of these guys lurk here (and I'm sure they do) be stand up about it and show you really support the flight sim genre and not just "only if it Il-2", buy a copy of BoB 2 WoV, if you already own WoV then update it to 2.11 and play it, and lastly if they really can handle this part RECOMMEND WoV to people who ask, with HD's that are 1TB standard nowadays having 2 BoB simulators isn't going to hurt.stalkervision wrote:I hate to say this about Il-2 and Cod.. but "what goes around comes around.."
I use to post nice BoB 2 screenies over on the Il-2 forums and was constantly ragged on and told how bad our game was and how dated it looked and just wait till COD came out how really bad it would be for our group here.
well they may have the graphics but not much more and STILL can't put the number of planes into the air that this game can and have it still flyable.
and you have to have a uber machine to even get that !
- stalkervision
- Chief Master Sergeant
- Posts: 3308
- Joined: 02 Feb 2007, 12:14
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
I couldn't have written a better synopsis about the whole WOV/COD history if I had tried G/Z.godzilla wrote:So true SV. While I really don't want to see any sim developer go under for obvious reasons, the fanboy crew at most of the Il-2 CLoD forums are not so high and mighty now. Many, many times I had seen various well known Il-2 fanboys rip on WoV to no end. What really got under my skin was if anyone would ask about current and available BoB simulators, (of course WoV would come up) the bash fest would begin. From "avoid it because it's a buggy mess" to "save your money for Il-2 CLoD" were the usual responses. I just couldn't understand this reasoning at all since Il2 CLod (then SoW)was still years away, so what harm could it have possibly done to a yet unreleased Il2 CLoD to steer these people to WoV as at the very least as a placeholder for Il2 CLoD? I mean WoV wasn't expensive and would play very well on most newer PC's. The real crux of the matter came out if anyone really pressed the issue with these posters bashing WoV as to why they felt WoV was so bad that it was better to wait 2 to 3 years (or more) for CLoD then to play WoV now. Thats when you found out they either only played the original release or stopped playing WoV after the earliest upgrades (like 2.06 or earlier) or that since it wasn't Il-2 (or a spinoff) developed by Oleg Maddox and crew it just wasn't a "real flight sim" . Now these same guys feel we all should throw our total support behind CLoD and have total understanding while CLoD goes through it's "growing pains". Well okay fair enough, I bought my copy of Il-2 CLoD when it first came out, paid full price for it too. But my one question for them is where was the same "understanding" for WoV? I've said it before but IMHO I really think these guys were so stoked that Il-2 CLoD was going to kill WoV they couldn't contain themselfs, their mantra seems to be one developer for all WW2 flight sims (aka the Highlander Syndrome). If any of these guys lurk here (and I'm sure they do) be stand up about it and show you really support the flight sim genre and not just "only if it Il-2", buy a copy of BoB 2 WoV, if you already own WoV then update it to 2.11 and play it, and lastly if they really can handle this part RECOMMEND WoV to people who ask, with HD's that are 1TB standard nowadays having 2 BoB simulators isn't going to hurt.stalkervision wrote:I hate to say this about Il-2 and Cod.. but "what goes around comes around.."
I use to post nice BoB 2 screenies over on the Il-2 forums and was constantly ragged on and told how bad our game was and how dated it looked and just wait till COD came out how really bad it would be for our group here.
well they may have the graphics but not much more and STILL can't put the number of planes into the air that this game can and have it still flyable.
and you have to have a uber machine to even get that !
excellent post !
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
I have never understood the them v us situation,the only people who lose are the ones who won't try.I have all 3 sims on my h/d and have enjoyed them all.
Clod hopefully will become the polished diamond it could be but WOV is special.
Clod hopefully will become the polished diamond it could be but WOV is special.
- stalkervision
- Chief Master Sergeant
- Posts: 3308
- Joined: 02 Feb 2007, 12:14
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
Frankly, I never understood this either.Trumper wrote:I have never understood the them v us situation,the only people who lose are the ones who won't try.I have all 3 sims on my h/d and have enjoyed them all.
Clod hopefully will become the polished diamond it could be but WOV is special.
Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
PappyCain wrote:Oh how true. I am amiss the prop flight sim genre is dying.
I don't think so:
Take a look at Rise of Flight:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8lTT3BayFnk
and
World of Planes (coming soon):
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wGKMQuq8jF8
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i5N1pxOdHBs
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Re: COD not forgotten: upgrade on its way soon...
Hi Seavee,
I have flown ROF and plan to again, but RL work is in the way ... had been in France, England etc. but now back in hell's half acre (freezing rain on top of a snow storm).
I will check out the videos - I miss flying my P47 and P51.
S'
PC
Update: Graphics are wonderful, stunning. Music is modern junkola and an immersion killer. Needs period WWII music eh? I want to watch a Hellcat listening to Glenn Miller LOL.
I have flown ROF and plan to again, but RL work is in the way ... had been in France, England etc. but now back in hell's half acre (freezing rain on top of a snow storm).
I will check out the videos - I miss flying my P47 and P51.
S'
PC
Update: Graphics are wonderful, stunning. Music is modern junkola and an immersion killer. Needs period WWII music eh? I want to watch a Hellcat listening to Glenn Miller LOL.
"Was it something I said?" - 'Moggy' Cattermole 'Piece of Cake'
Core 2 Duo E6700, ASUS P5N-E-SLI, 2GB Corsair DDR2 PC6400,ASUS Nvidia GeForce GTX 560Ti, Coolermaster 650W PSU and Case, Audigy 2ZS Platinum, 5.1 Z-640, XP Pro, 22" CHIMEI LCD
Core 2 Duo E6700, ASUS P5N-E-SLI, 2GB Corsair DDR2 PC6400,ASUS Nvidia GeForce GTX 560Ti, Coolermaster 650W PSU and Case, Audigy 2ZS Platinum, 5.1 Z-640, XP Pro, 22" CHIMEI LCD
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