Raindrop effects

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Tony73
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Raindrop effects

Post by Tony73 »

Hello, why not do as Tecnam P2002 Sierra for a raindrops effect on virtual cockpit? It's impossible?
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Lewis - A2A
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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by Lewis - A2A »

Hello,

this wouldn't be appropriate for the Accu-feel product as its a general add-on that is designed to be transparent, so you don't need to edit any files etc for aircraft. Raindrops is possible in FSX but that would be for a per plane basis, they are quite old tech so you get an old outdated FS2004 style effect + take up quite a lot of things that could be used for other systems and animations etc.

thanks,
Lewis
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Tony73
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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by Tony73 »

I understand Lewis, thank you for the answer.
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FrankK
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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by FrankK »

Sorry Lewis I think you are wrong on this. The raindrop effects are available for example in the RealAir Duke Prop and more recent Duke Turbine V2 in FSX. It is not what you are naming as a 2004 effect it is much newer than that. They are not “static” drops that appear in the 2D cockpit in flight. The “drops” in both Dukes give the impression of moving upward and across the windscreen when it rains in flight in the 3D cockpit in FSX and it is quite immersive particularly with Weather Architect or Active Sky Next active and in stormy weather.

I think you need to see this to understand the effect.

There have also been a lot of requests for this in this Forum over the last few years. What are these resources you say in Accu-Sim will be affected (in a previous post)? I think it was Rob who said it is tied in with the aircraft model so why cannot this be added?

Seems to me A2A are falling behind others without this inclusion.
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Lewis - A2A
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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by Lewis - A2A »

The effect is still quite dated and larks back to FS2004. A modern dx10+ effect is out of the question for MSFS at this time and the limitations are what keep us from having the effect.

You can either have our high fidelity in our Accu-sim simulation engine with all the moving parts the dynamic internal combustion engine, the correct needles, gauges that not only move correctly but shake correctly too (not like the guage is always attached to a P-40 for example) or you can have a dated rain effect.

We will naturally always choose core simulation fidelity over using up a bunch of the animation limits (And thats the rub, a rain effect takes up a bunch of various counts which are limited per aircraft) on an old rain effect. Also remember for 90% of flying there is NO rain effect in reality anyway.

thanks,
Lewis
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FrankK
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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by FrankK »

Thanks for the reply Lewis.
Lewis have you actually seen the rain effect in the Duke Prop and Turbine.? Both Dukes aircraft also have practically what Accu-Sim offers, and yes vibrations as well. So I am still not convinced that it can’t be done.

I have been using Flightsim for more than 25 years and don’t recall having seen this before, certainly not in the FS 2004 version. Where on what aircraft was it done in the 2004 version - I’d be interested in the details.

Regards.
Smithy

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Lewis - A2A
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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by Lewis - A2A »

By default FS2004 had a rain effect. It can be done but as me tokens your talking about removing a bunch of fidelity which is something we are not prepared to do for a lack luster effect than I say again has no real bearing in reality other than ground ops and even then it's 2015 so using the old style effects is a bit cheesy when up against actual correct shader based effects like those seen I modern games for actual droplets and movement correctly rendered.

FSX has animation and other limitations you have a set number to use so adding the old style rain effects means removing a bunch of our animations be it correct vibrating as tested by us in the real aircraft and not generic vibrations across all gauges or panel movement or even the movement of the preflight bits and correct stall and spin again as tested by us in the real aircraft during our real world flight testing.

Thanks,
Lewis


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FrankK
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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by FrankK »

Thanks Lewis, but you did not answer my question. Have you seen the effect in the Dukes? The FSX 2004 rain effect is not, and I emphasize, not, what has been done in the Dukes. I would suggest that the A2A developers just go and have a look at the effect. It is actually quite mild and does not appear to affect my FPS but adds to the immersive aspect of flight.

As an ‘old dog’ ex pilot and more than 25 year user of FS it makes the experience a little more realistic even when you say its only “10%” of the time. Well it’s actually more than that now that Weather Architect has arrived with its inserted storm/rain fronts that are quite realistic to fly in apart from current crop of A2A aircraft. They are missing the visual effect of rain hitting the windscreen in FSX.

I don’t believe that anyone can judge beforehand whether inclusion of this effect will have any major influence on the operation of the internals of Accu-Sim. I hope Lewis you don’t mined me saying so - its just speculation at present until it is tried out.

As always thanks for this robust discussion, as it’s the way for achieving progress in any field.

Best Regards.
Smithy

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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by Snuffy »

Diffrnt strokes for different folks ... somes like rain, somes don't. :)
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spacejunkee
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Re: Raindrop effects

Post by spacejunkee »

FrankK wrote:Thanks Lewis, but you did not answer my question. Have you seen the effect in the Dukes? The FSX 2004 rain effect is not, and I emphasize, not, what has been done in the Dukes. I would suggest that the A2A developers just go and have a look at the effect. It is actually quite mild and does not appear to affect my FPS but adds to the immersive aspect of flight.

As an ‘old dog’ ex pilot and more than 25 year user of FS it makes the experience a little more realistic even when you say its only “10%” of the time. Well it’s actually more than that now that Weather Architect has arrived with its inserted storm/rain fronts that are quite realistic to fly in apart from current crop of A2A aircraft. They are missing the visual effect of rain hitting the windscreen in FSX.

I don’t believe that anyone can judge beforehand whether inclusion of this effect will have any major influence on the operation of the internals of Accu-Sim. I hope Lewis you don’t mined me saying so - its just speculation at present until it is tried out.

As always thanks for this robust discussion, as it’s the way for achieving progress in any field.

Best Regards.
I'd have to agree with Lewis and A2A's decision to stand where they are in regards to the fidelity of their simulations. Now, with that said would it be possible to recreate what was done in the Duke? Possibly (I have no idea just assumption here), but that would in-turn take away from something else. I believe Lewis was trying to stress that they have used up every possible animation and or effect in order to bring us that amazing A2A fidelity (aircraft DNA). From my limited experience with FSX development, there is a set limit to what one can do to a simobject (plane/heli) so no matter if it's an older FS9 effect or something new (rain effect in the Duke (assuming it's not fs9 effect)) it will still take away from something else to make it happen.
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