A2A support for FSW?

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pressler
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A2A support for FSW?

Post by pressler »

So with the announcement that P3Dv4 being released on the 30th and A2A is committed to providing products on day 1, I haven't heard or seen anything mentioned about FSW. Instead of me speculating one way or the other, do we know yet how or if A2A will provide products for FSW? In my mind the answer is extremely important - meaning, if DTG is going to lollygag around for a year or two trying to figure out how to make a sim and get 3PP involved, then I will have to make a decision as to the sim I want to use going forward.

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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by Alfredson007 »

pressler wrote:So with the announcement that P3Dv4 being released on the 30th and A2A is committed to providing products on day 1, I haven't heard or seen anything mentioned about FSW. Instead of me speculating one way or the other, do we know yet how or if A2A will provide products for FSW? In my mind the answer is extremely important - meaning, if DTG is going to lollygag around for a year or two trying to figure out how to make a sim and get 3PP involved, then I will have to make a decision as to the sim I want to use going forward.
My guess is they do not know yet...? But i sure hope they'll support it.

I just ordered a new GPU and i think i'll buy FSW anyway. It's not expensive and to support the genre, hope they deserve it.

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CAPFlyer
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by CAPFlyer »

There will most likely not be any announcements of support for FSW until DTG release an actual 3rd party policy publically and release anyone under NDA (which hasn't happened AFAIK). Anyone claiming to know what DTG's policy is now is speaking only on rumor and not actual statements of fact by DTG. DTG themselves have stated only that all "official" addons will need to be available via Steam and DTG's in-program storefront in addition to any other mode of download. Beyond that, they've specifically stated on the Steam and DTG forums that there is no hard policy at this time as they're not to that point yet.
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by Taka taka »

Considering that Accufeel is already incorporated into the game I would bet there will be A2A aircraft for the game, eventually.
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by Alfredson007 »

This is probably been discussed on another threads but .. i cannot see the "pure devil" of their rumoured official addon policy. I mean most of us could and would buy the addons directly from A2A, leaving DS and steam provisions out, to support the real developers. On the another hand, steam cut is not pure waste either, there are alot of users on steam and i'm sure more people would find the addons they might be interested in, which would lead to higher sales figures. But of course i'd like to see that as an option for addon developers. And if DT has any sense this is how they will do it.

I am pretty sure Dovetail understands their situation. Casual simmers would/should find aerofly fs2 much more appealing, and hc simmers do nothing with DSW without proper addons.

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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by n421nj »

If accufeel is incorporated then that is very good news. It means a2a and dovetail have already spoken and we will prob be the last to know whats going on. Perhaps fsw is what a2a are waiting on before announcing the next product.
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mallcott
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by mallcott »

Why would A2A commit to a product that, as of now, is only in early beta?

What you are seeing is the difference in commercial models - FSW is doing their development in the open, wracked by the idiot opinions of indelible morons with a mouth to proffer opinion, but no brain to actually formulate one. I do wonder whether the desire to become an `early adopter` should actually be enough to preclude one from ever being one, because I fail to see how this approach has benefitted DTG. At all.
As it stands it's a half-assed product nowhere near release quality, bought by persons who, in the main, fail to appreciate that, and are incapable of lending a hand to develop the thing in the public domain. For example the Alabeo DA42 in FSW has ALL the faults of the FSX/P3d model, as well as some new ones. That's just stupid when they (DTG) could have asked/demanded of Alabeo they actually do the job properly if they want their wannabe product inserted in their wannabe sim. And where did that RV9 come from? And why?

Destined to become a footnote in flight simulation history? Probably. Unless they can create a rapidly-accelerating development program and a sense of clarity about the commercial perspectives.

Which is sadly, something DTG have never managed, ever, with any of their software. So don't hold your breath... :oops:


Meanwhile, and unsurprisingly, LM understand that you do your development behind closed doors, and release a finished product to your customers, not a half-finished-one-with-excuses. Customers are for selling to, not leeching from. New version, fit for purpose on release. It's not a new idea! :D

As a result, sensing the increasing frustration of FSW punters already, there's likely going to be a faster take-up on Day One of release for P3Dv4, never mind prior availability of FSW EA 64-bit or the (supposedly) stringent license requirements of the LM sim.
Reason is that a relatively `fixed point` for the software and behind-the-scenes development WITH the aftermarket enables LM and the Third Party developers to offer guarantees simply unavailable to FSW customers, from that very first day. Anyone who thinks that confusion over Steam-sold software isn't harming FSW sales need only look at the sheer speed with which addon developers have been able to offer guarantees on porting and compliance and even free updates for v4.

P3d is about to steal ALL of FSW's momentum, and it will happen within days of release. Why else has the release been timed as such? Anyone really think that for one of the Worlds leading defence contractors it's coincidence? :roll:

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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by Tutmeister »

Absolutely it is a coincidence.
Anyone really think that one of the Worlds leading defence contractors cares about dtg and their early access title that isn't even licensed for the same sort of use?

I also bet that, with the exception off ooms, in a month everyone will be complaining about this or that not working in p3d just like they do now! :)

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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by Roadburner426 »

mallcott wrote:P3d is about to steal ALL of FSW's momentum, and it will happen within days of release. Why else has the release been timed as such? Anyone really think that for one of the Worlds leading defence contractors it's coincidence? :roll:
I would have to agree with this. For me seeing all of the developers that have come out and either said stuff is coming on day one, or it is going to take a little bit of work but things will be coming. Plus seeing the development teams all commenting on how pleased they are with v4's performance is what finally got me off the ledge. I almost fell for FSW, but I am so glad now that I held off.
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by CAPFlyer »

The only reason so much stuff is "day 1" P3D v4 is the amount of changed needed from v3 to v4 on the developer side is almost nothing in terms of time. It's changing a few references and maybe recompiling your stuff for 64-bit and full-res textures that were previously compressed. Everyone claiming that P3Dv4 is a "game changer" are the same people who immediately dismiss FSW for "not being that big of a change", despite the fact that so far, both FSW and P3D have done the exact same thing - released a 64-bit file system with DX11 graphics. None of these changes fundamentally change the sim itself, only the way it is displayed to you and how that display is processed. The difference between XP10 and XP11 is a major step forward for that program. Not just 64-bit, but major changes in how it handles things and major changes in its file structure, which is why it's taking time for developers for XPlane to be ready for release.
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spork
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by spork »

I think it would be fairly straightforward for them to do (though I'm no expert so I have no idea what I'm talking about). However, I have very bad feelings about FSW after playing it for a couple hours. I actually saw worse performance than P3Dv3.4 with active sky, Global with vector and openlc NA, and the A2A 172. To me, the rain drops on the windshield are not enough to continue supporting what in effect is just them catching up to LM. I got a refund and don't plan on ever looking back.
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mallcott
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by mallcott »

CAPFlyer wrote:The only reason so much stuff is "day 1" P3D v4 is the amount of changed needed from v3 to v4 on the developer side is almost nothing in terms of time. It's changing a few references and maybe recompiling your stuff for 64-bit and full-res textures that were previously compressed. Everyone claiming that P3Dv4 is a "game changer" are the same people who immediately dismiss FSW for "not being that big of a change", despite the fact that so far, both FSW and P3D have done the exact same thing - released a 64-bit file system with DX11 graphics. None of these changes fundamentally change the sim itself, only the way it is displayed to you and how that display is processed. The difference between XP10 and XP11 is a major step forward for that program. Not just 64-bit, but major changes in how it handles things and major changes in its file structure, which is why it's taking time for developers for XPlane to be ready for release.
None of which has any relevance on the commercialisation. What DOES have impact is the way in which it's conveyed to the developer community and the user base. DTG look like amateurs with no supporters, LM look like professionals with an on side developer base.

The issue is not where the sims are going - one would have to be a retard to think v4 isn't at the very START of its development - but rather how the development is funded - which makes DTG look like they're in desperate straights just a week after reveal.

It's not scientific but I polled the user base at the flying club today. Not a single one is moving or adding FSW to their computers. All are `thinking about`upgrading to P4D v4 soon after release - and trust me, this is most certainly NOT an `early adopter` crowd. And the mix between FSX and P3D users has been gravitating toward P3D for some time.

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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by CAPFlyer »

And I'll go back to we don't know how it's being communicated by DTG. The only people communicating are people clearly not involved in any development (i.e. not DTG, and not groups already involved like A2A and Carenado), or they're not developers period who are making assumptions based on 1 report that was half read and totally misunderstood and taken as gospel and spread like wildfire as fact. You're continuing that line of "communication" because instead of looking at the facts, you're making assumptions.

P3Dv4 is releasing in 2 days.
FSW is releasing in MONTHS.

P3D v4 is a linear iteration of an existing, mature and ongoing development.
FSW is a exponential iteration of a mature development, but one that's been "dead" for some time (nearly a decade).

DTG is trying to do in 1 iteration what Lockheed has done in roughly a dozen. They have a lot more hurdles to cross before they can release anything close to what P3Dv4 is and thus there's a lot more for them to do. Yes, they're desperate. They got delayed heavily by TSW. It's cost them development time that's put them from releasing last fall to now potentially not releasing until next year sometime.

And again, I'll continue to wait and see what goes where and I have no plan on purchasing P3D at any time not because I don't like it, but I still feel there's a shoe to fall because at some point, someone is going to force Lockheed to verify it's not selling to users who don't fit their licensing requirement. I think the sales have been low enough (again, much much less than FSX and FSX:SE) to date as to not raise problems, but if Microsoft or Dovetail see a large number of sales happening to P3D, there will be an issue and it's something Lockheed's warned about for years but the community continues to ignore.
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by AKar »

So, if anything, it is fairly clear that everyone has picked his side in this imagined clash that is maybe the biggest since 1962? ;) Damn, I though the competition was non-existent in between the FSX-based platforms! :mrgreen:

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bladerunner900
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Re: A2A support for FSW?

Post by bladerunner900 »

See, I don't see it as a clash. I see it as having more options. We all have different priorities and my priority is in what Sim the A2A Spitfire will run. I already have three sims to choose from, if you count FSX Gold, Steam and P3D v3. A fourth or even a fifth, if it ever comes to FSW as well would be just dandy. :wink:

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