The A2A Simulations Community

I don't mean to offend, purely historical matters here, however I would like to share this interesting bit of Nazi-era 'landscaping' with you all, I'm sure you'll find it interesting nonetheless. This is still the period we're lingering in right now.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forest_swastika

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© 2011 Peter J. Carlson, All Rights Reserved
"O! for a horse with wings!" -William Shakespeare

Note to Germans: contains photography of banned symbols.

@Peter: it is illegal for German residents to view that symbol.

Best regards,
Robin.

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A2A/AccuSim. 'nuff said!

Peter stated that he did not wish to offend. If our German visitors wish to come to A2A's international forums and freely discuss, view, or engage us and our "Liberties" then they are welcome here.
If they are forbidden to cast their eyes upon such things, well, they should change their county's laws and lawmakers !

This is America, "Do Not Tread" on our freedoms. One can "spit, burn, destroy, urinate and defecate" on our national flag and get away with it.

I'm off the soapbox,...next representative speaker, is your turn to speak up and initiate change....

Sorry, Robin It is only illegal to display that symbol outside of a documented historic context. For example, they have been removed from building exteriors and are omitted from restored aircraft, but photos and documents are not censored and they are permitted in films for period accuracy. Check out "Downfall".



Flameout, easy there, cowboy. It's a great big world out there and other countries have different laws and customs. Before you insist on imposing your views on others, bear in mind the less tolerent individuals that want to do the same to us.

Or movies like The Rocketeer, Raiders of the Lost Ark, Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade etc., for that matter, which are shown on TV with no problems, despite the numerous swastikas that are displayed in them.


@FlameOut
As for changing laws and lawmakers: don't forget that it's more appropriate to show someone's head getting blown off in graphic detail than showing a naked person in the US. So, no need and reason at all to act so high and mighty.

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Happy Landings
- Patrick

Would a restored German aircraft (in Germany) not count as documented historic context? To me that is history you can see, hear, touch and smell, and in many ways is more valuable than a documentary. I'm not trying to start an argument, I'm genuinely curious about where that line is drawn. I suppose if it is seen as a really big piece of memorabilia then I can see the reasoning.

Jigsaw- I totally agree with your point about American TV, there is soooo much graphic violence all the time, yet one little nipple pops out during the Super Bowl and there is mass hyseria and panic, women screaming, old people fainting, buildings start to crumble.. you get my point I figure more nudity and less exploding body parts would make for a much more healthy population of TV viewers.

Joe

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Joe, are you French?

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© 2011 Peter J. Carlson, All Rights Reserved
"O! for a horse with wings!" -William Shakespeare

No, Peter, I am not French. I'm an ex-pat Brit living in America, and for all intents and purposes I am American. While my comments on US TV were supposed to be tongue-in-cheek, I really do think the FCC needs to lighten up and get it's priorities straight. Seeing a nipple on TV shouldn't be a cause for people getting upset and companies and individuals being fined: it's kind of a natural thing, everyone has them. I just don't see what the big deal is. However, watching people being graphically mutilated and murdered all day long surely has a worse effect on impressionable minds?

Joe

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I can't agree more. I asked if you were French because you outlined the French logic there. Except the worst thing here is that male nudity gets PG-13 and female almost always gets R, but I don't really want to see the former.

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© 2011 Peter J. Carlson, All Rights Reserved
"O! for a horse with wings!" -William Shakespeare

The difference is preservation as opposed to restoration. They'll leave an original alone, but will not paint a new one. I wonder what happened to the tile in the chapel of the kaserne where I was stationed. The kaserene had been built for the SS and the chapel had been their ceremony room. There was carpet when I was there but it could be lifted to see the little swastikas in the tile. The reason I wonder is that the building is now a German ministry. Ironically it's the Federal Office for Migration and Refugees, the very people the SS would have wanted to kill. One of the dilemmas in Germany right now is what to do about the rally grounds in Nürnberg. The stone work is badly frost damaged and crumbling. They don't want to let it disintegrate, yet no one wants to spend money for repairs.

Greasysidedown

You mean Bad Tölz , maybe ?
There was in wartime the SS Junkerschool and after the war the Green Barretts were there.

Nope, Nürnberg. On the southeast side of town is the Südkaserne, which was built for the SS, in the hands of the U.S.Army from 1945 until 1992 and is now a German government ministry. About a half a mile or so east is the Kongresshalle and southeast of that is the Zeppelnfeld which is where I took the picture above. The structure is the main reviewing stand and is where Hitler would speak during the later party rallies.

The SS did have schools at Bad Tölz and at Vogelsang. U.S.Army SF were at Bad Tölz.

Oh, it's green BERET, a barrett is a clip for hair.

"Note to Germans: contains photography of banned symbols."

I'm a brit living in Germany and If you ask me allowing the Germans to bury their history was one of the worst mistakes made after the war. I don't want to insult anyone (there are many good Germans don't get me wrong) but the atmosphere changed here dramatically when the media decided that Germans should no longer be ashamed about Hitler and the war, and since then the atmosphere here has just simply deteriorated. I think they should be confronted with their past and learn from it as most of the rest of the world has done. I hope to leave this country soon.
Sorry I don't normaly mix politics with my hobby which normaly helps me to forget the problems of living in this country

M. Jordan

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Hu? I'm German and honestly I don't get why you think we would bury our history.
For example Hitler, his raise to power and regime is probably the very most covered subject in history lessons at school (the next best thing then is Imperialism and WW1... go figures)
Our country is clustered with memorials to remind us of the wrong doings in that period.
We do have our anti-war movies like “Die Brücke”, “Das Boot”, “Stalingrad” or “Der Untergang”.
I personally stopped watching TV (horrible program...) but I deem it impossible to find one month in the year without a Hitler, Nazi or WW2 related documentary. (Info: there are about 10 different documentaries on Hitler, Nazis, WW2 or NS this month alone on ntv, N24, ZDF, phoenix and SWR. Not all new of course but they are still running)
There are many exhibitions about the National Socialism in Germany. Not all of them (or none) gets the attention as the „Wehrmachtsausstellung“ but well such is life.
I'm also pretty sure we learned from past mistakes. Just compare the structure of our current state to the Weimarer Republic or check the regulations of the Bundeswehr and compare it to the Wehrmacht.

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Hi Ishigami

I don't wan't to upset you or anyone else here, as I said normaly I don't mix politics with flight simulation and I won't go into any further details on this forum other than the fact that when the media started questioning whether the German people should still feel guilty about Hitler and the War, the atmosphere here got so bad that my family in Britain had heard about it even before I mentioned it to them.
I have had threats to my life from neo nazis, my children have constant problems about their Nationality in which the people in positions of resposibility act worse than the other children, my children don't want to stay here either.
The list could go on but I will leave it there. I am glad I have the FS to take my mind off of such things untill I can go back to Britain.
I still like Germany as a country and I like and get on well with many Germans, but I can't continue to live in this atmosphere.
Most Germans I know have no idea of what happened in the war and many youths see Fascism as "being German".
Sorry I will leave it there, this isn't a political forum, I hope you don't feel insulted, nothing here is meant that way.
I used to love Germany!

M. Jordan

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