Trim spins out of control

[abmis]

I just purchased the 182 for P2Dv3.4 and it is a wonderful aircraft. I do have an issue that is driving me nuts.

When I use the autopilot at some point during an extended flight (an hour or so) the trim will just go nuts, causing a complete loss of control of the aircraft. With sufficient altitude the resulting stall is recoverable, though this is not always the case. If nothing else it sure is a pain if I happen to step away for a min. This sometimes happens after a few minutes and sometimes it can take quite some time, but it happens almost every single flight. I have tested other aircraft from other vendors and do not seem to have the issue no matter how long I fly.
This is a brand new rig and at the moment all I have is Orbx scenery your aircraft and the carenado 208B for payware. Also running Active Sky Next, but have turned it off. Haven't really installed anything else for the sim. Any ideas?

[Lewis - A2A]

Hello,

have you ran the latest Accu-sim updater would be the first place to start with troubleshooting;
http://a2asimulations.com/forum/viewtop ... 21&t=57819

Also can you give us more information on your system and hardware you are using to control as well as the conditions you are flying in. Have you tried a weather situation with no third party weather program started.

thanks,
Lewis

[Nick - A2A]

Hi - welcome to the forums.

One function in P3D which is known to cause trim runaway is the "Autothrottle enagage (TOGA)" command. Therefore, if you have a joystick button or key assigned to this and it's been activated, that would be one explanation.

You could also check for a control conflict in the A2A input configurator, where there's an axis function for elevator trim.

Finally, are you sure the aircraft actually has the performance to do what the autopilot is telling it to? For instance, if you've used the autopilot to command a climb rate which the aircraft isn't capable of maintaining as its performance drops off with altitude, it will gradually trim the nose up until the aircraft stalls.

Thanks,
Nick

[abmis]

Lewis,
I'm using a Logitech extreme 3D Pro Stick for control, have used one for decades when I don't feel like the while yoke and pedals setup.
I have turned off third party weather and set it to clear skies in the sim.
I have been flying from MYGF in the Bahamas to KFXE in Fort Lauderdale, FL, it's about a thirty to forty minute flight, there's really no need for the AP, but I'm trying to get acquainted for longer hauls.

I did download the update for Accu-sim last night after I posted and will let you know what happens as I test it out today.

Nick,

Shift + Ctrl + G is the key combination for the Autothrottle engage (TOGA), I don't think I'm 'accidently' engaging that option
I have the button assignments setup as joystick buttons AND keyboard keys for the trim from inside the simulator. The assignments are blank inside the A2A configurator. I also have FSUIPC, but I have the unregistered version and have no key mappings there.

As far as exceeding the performance envelope, a vast majority of the time this happens is when I'm flying straight and level at cruise speed (no weather). Even so, AP settings are realistic with a cruise altitude of 4,ooo to 6,000 agl and I usually don't exceed a VS of 700 fpm.

I have a few other aircraft that I fly without this being an issue, among my favorites is the 208B from Carenado.

I am not new to flight simming, though I am new to A2A. This is a new rig I have set up and I am anxious to have it fly properly.

Thanks for the help and suggestions, going to see if the update straightened things out.

Cheers all!

[Nick - A2A]

Thanks for the detailed reply abmis. Interested to hear how you get on with the update installed. "Runaway trim" threads have cropped-up from time-to-time and usually the culprit seems to be a control conflict of some sort (e.g. here), though this seems unlikely in your case with the unregistered version of FSUIPC.

If the problem persists, I'd still suggest disabling FSUIPC as part of the troubleshooting process, as it has been involved in strange issues in the past.

Cheers,
Nick

[abmis]

I installed the update and I thought I was ok, did a two short (< 1 hour) flights and all was good, then I attempted a longer flight, Ft laud to Jax, about 2 hours and the trim went out of control.

Oddly when the trim goes out of control, it always goes out of control bringing the nose up, like it's trying to recover from a dive or some other loss of altitude. It's almost like a key is stuck, once it starts it just keeps going, only recourse is to shut off the AP and recover from the stalled condition.

I followed your link to the earlier post and noted that the OP said he had assignments for the joystick AND the keyboard, and while I think this should be just fine I am going to remove the keyboard assignments. I don't know why this might help, but I am going to try. The keyboard I have is a Razer Synapse and is only a few months old, no keys are sticking, so I can rule that out.

Will keep all posted, thanks for the help.

[mallcott]

Were you running accelerated time?

[abmis]

Were you running accelerated time?

No

[Nick - A2A]

Okay, thanks for the update abmis. It does sound a bit like some functionality of the default autopilot is being triggered. If removing keyboard shortcuts doesn't help, I also recommend removing FSUIPC from the equation whilst troubleshooting.

Also, is the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro the only hardware that you currently have connected? (i.e. is the yoke you mention above unplugged?)

Thanks,
Nick

[abmis]

Okay, thanks for the update abmis. It does sound a bit like some functionality of the default autopilot is being triggered. If removing keyboard shortcuts doesn't help, I also recommend removing FSUIPC from the equation whilst troubleshooting.

Also, is the Logitech Extreme 3D Pro the only hardware that you currently have connected? (i.e. is the yoke you mention above unplugged?)

Thanks,
Nick

No the Logitech joystick is the only controller attached and I removed FSUIPC, even though it was the unregistered version with limited ability.

[abmis]

removing the keystroke assignments did not help.

Since this is a new build and I only have a couple things installed I have uninstalled and have re-installed P3Dv3.4 in the root directory of the boot drive as opposed to the Program Files directory.
Installed the 182 and the sim, no problems.
One at a time I reinstalled what I had on that system up to that point. All I had was the Orbx scenery trio, Active Sky Next, which I decided to run on another system and use simconnect, one airport and one paid aircraft. After each install I ran a few longer flights, all good-to-go.

I had run flight after flight, would leave and come back and still flying to destination.

Everything was looking good, was going to report back, figuring maybe installing P3D in a less restrictive directory may have 'fixed' the issue.
A couple nights later I took off and retired to the porch to talk a buddy that dropped by and not 5 minutes after I sat down my wife came running out to tell me the aircraft was going crazy and I was going to crash, hasn't done that in over 50 flt hours, only one thing has changed ... I had installed Norton 360 earlier that day as I felt a little naked without it.

I don't know why, or what it could be doing, but I have to assume that Norton 360 is the culprit.

[Nick - A2A]

Hello - thanks for the update. Yes, it does sound like Norton AV could be responsible. I know it has the reputation for being pretty invasive when it comes to real time protection. Presumably it's possible to define the P3D directory as an 'excluded location' in the Norton settings.

Cheers,
Nick

[Lewis - A2A]

Hello,

yes Norton is kinda bottom of he list when it comes to preferred AV solutions for gamers (simmers too) due to its high false positive rate, intrusiveness and resource issues over its competitors.

As Nick suggests you can try a full exception but also I wonder if your running the sim as admin might help you in this area too.

thanks,
Lewis

[abmis]

Hello,

yes Norton is kinda bottom of he list when it comes to preferred AV solutions for gamers (simmers too) due to its high false positive rate, intrusiveness and resource issues over its competitors.

As Nick suggests you can try a full exception but also I wonder if your running the sim as admin might help you in this area too.

thanks,
Lewis

I am running P3D as an administrator.

I know Norton is a resource hog I liked having it for it's light firewall abilities.