Operating costs???

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n421nj
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Operating costs???

Post by n421nj »

Any real word owners that could shed some light on how much you put aside per hour for operating costs? I'm guessing $50 per engine hour or is that too high or too low?
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AKar
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by AKar »

Oh my, that's a question. :mrgreen: It seriously depends! I don't own one, but unfortunately having been in position of making up a portion of the bills for a few.

I don't know the US general aviation costs, but if you did operate a newish 182T for less than, my wild guess would be, $150 per hour all inclusive up to the moment you brought it in for the next engine overhaul, and that included (here assuming the previous overhaul, or the new-built costs are included in financial costs), I'd really want to know more!

-Esa

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Oracle427
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by Oracle427 »

To simply overhaul the engine at 2000 hours and nothing else you'll be safe at $25/hr if you are flying at least 200 hours per year. If fast less hours are being flown inflation will drive that rate higher.

Then you have the prop overhaul which can be around $2 per hour.

Fuel burn is around 13-14GPH, so let's say $80/hr.

Maintenance in the NE is easily $35/hr.

$150 total to round up to the nearest $10.
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AKar
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Re: Operating costs???

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Oracle427 wrote:To simply overhaul the engine at 2000 hours and nothing else you'll be safe at $25/hr if you are flying at least 200 hours per year. If fast less hours are being flown inflation will drive that rate higher.

Then you have the prop overhaul which can be around $2 per hour.

Fuel burn is around 13-14GPH, so let's say $80/hr.

Maintenance in the NE is easily $35/hr.

$150 total to round up to the nearest $10.
Indeed, and up from that are the financials and the related costs...I'm actually surprised you get that easily out there even with the operationals. A lucky guess, but it seems we agree the ballpark. :)

FWIW, I used roughly 8 GPH (assuming all the idling), maintenance of $100/h, and didn't even consider the prop separately. And I discounted all the rest, as if you owned one, plus the insurance...

-Esa

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Oracle427
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by Oracle427 »

We operate a 182T for $160/hr including all reserves and some financing/depreciation costs.

There is a separate bucket for fixed costs such as annual, insurance, repainting reserve, GPS & XM subscriptions, hangar/tie down etc. That can easily add up to $17K/year alone!! That is the reason I went for the shared ownership model because the hourly flying cost isn't the problem!

All it takes is one major unplanned maintenance issue to ground the airplane and you financially! :)
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n421nj
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by n421nj »

I didn't factor in fuel costs because that will vary based on how you fly and current fuel prices at different locations. I was looking more at prop and engine overhaul hoping to fly about 200 hrs a year.
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n421nj
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by n421nj »

I didn't factor in fuel costs because that will vary based on how you fly and current fuel prices at different locations. I was looking more at prop and engine overhaul hoping to fly about 200 hrs a year.
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AKar
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by AKar »

n421nj wrote:I was looking more at prop and engine overhaul hoping to fly about 200 hrs a year.
I am sure it depends in the States as well, but as of today, IO-540-AB1A5 overhauls seem to be roughly around $30k to take a guess of what was quoted to a shop. Prop is perhaps $2k or something. If we took the Lycoming's recommended TBOs as a starting point, that would make about $16/h if running it for 2000 hours, or roughly $2650/year if running it for 12 years. Yours may vary. In my (limited) experience, simply dividing overhaul costs per hour or month, and adding consumables will not provide a realistic budget. Just be unlucky and pop a can, and that sets you back some $1k at least. In some engines, a few cylinders over the OVH cycle should be treated as mere consumable. :mrgreen: I don't know about -AB1A5, though.

-Esa

n421nj
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by n421nj »

So by those numbers - 32k for overhaul and prop every 2000 hrs. If flying 200 hrs a year that's an overhaul every 10 years ( barring any unforeseen damage or problems) 32,000 /10= 3,200 has to be saved each year to have enough for overhaul. 3200/200 hrs = $16 a flight hour towards overhaul and new prop. This of course doesn't include the annual inspection or oil changes.
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AKar
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by AKar »

Yes, but you can be certain that it won't work out that way. :)

-Esa

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Oracle427
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by Oracle427 »

32K is a very low overhaul cost for an IO-540-A*. That number sounds like a lot of parts costs will be tacked on such as cylinders.
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AKar
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Re: Operating costs???

Post by AKar »

Yes, that's how low you can roughly get with OVH'd cylinders and I'd guess with only mandatory replacements, according to the prices Google found for me. If handled by a shop, a small discount is often given to the shop's price by the overhauler, which the shop "in between" may fill up as their handling fee by quoting closer to the original list price to the customer.

For reference, MRSP for factory overhauled IO-540-AB1AD apparently was $45k in 2012.

-Esa

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