New to 172 sim / Have several questions

[rgenet]

Hello A2A pilots, I'm Russ and just getting started. I have flown 172's in the past, but have not been flying much recently. I want to supplement my expensive flight time with some sim time. I have a few questions. Any suggestions would be most welcome!

** I presume FSX Steam is the basic software I need. Any best place to buy it?
** Of course I'll get the A2A 172. Any other software I need?
** I currently have an old HP laptop running XP. However I plan on getting a new laptop with an i7. Needs to be lightweight. Any suggestions of what specks I should consider for my new laptop? Best graphics chip?
** I currently have one 27 inch monitor, but have desk space to add a couple more. Would the Matrox TripleHead2Go unit be what I should get to handle three monitors?
** Would adding two more monitors do much to the flight experience? Does anyone use touch monitors or any reason to consider them? I presume VR googles like Oculus too low res?
** What are the most important physical controls or other goodies to purchase? I presume the Cessna yoke and rudder peddles are a must.
** Does a throttle add much? ** Physical trim?
** Add Saitek radios or just use the ones on the sim?
** Any other useful goodies to add that i should consider?
** Any recommendations on books or videos?

Thanks and cheers for any suggestions.

Russ

[Nick - A2A]

Hi Russ - welcome to the forums. I can't answer all your questions as I've never bothered with advanced hardware or a multi-monitor setup myself, but I'll get you started...

** I presume FSX Steam is the basic software I need. Any best place to buy it?

Either The Steam Edition of FSX or Lockheed Martin's Prepar3d ("P3D") are the best options. P3D is still being developed and offers slightly more advanced rendering and lighting options with the same basic platform; however, it's a bit more demanding on hardware. For a laptop, FSX-SE is probably the best bet, though I'm sure there are plenty of folks who run P3D happily on gaming laptops too. Either software title can be purchased from the links above; just bear in mind that A2A offers a separate version for each in their store.

** Of course I'll get the A2A 172. Any other software I need?

No not really, but many FSX/P3D users do also invest in enhanced scenery, airports and weather generation engines as well as various other utilities. You can spend as much or as little as you like.

** I currently have an old HP laptop running XP. However I plan on getting a new laptop with an i7. Needs to be lightweight. Any suggestions of what specks I should consider for my new laptop? Best graphics chip?

Not really much experience of gaming spec laptops, but NVIDIA graphics cards are almost universally recognised to be the best for FSX/P3D.

I'm sure others will chip in too...

Nick

[BPL]

Hi, Russ, and welcome to the forums! You've come to the right place if you want the most realistic aircraft in the world of flight simulation!

Nick has answered a few of your questions, and I'm sure others will chime in. I'll address an aspect of one of your questions:

** What are the most important physical controls or other goodies to purchase? I presume the Cessna yoke and rudder peddles are a must.

The question of what yoke to buy is a little controversial among flight simmers, and you can find several threads on the topic on these forums. I'll weigh in with my personal opinion. I have owned both the Saitek Pro Flight Cessna Yoke and the CH Products Flight Sim Yoke, and I would recommend the CH Flight Sim Yoke instead of the Saitek Cessna Yoke. Scott (the owner of A2A Simulations) gives, IMO, a very good description of Saitek vs. CH Products yokes in these two posts (and maybe touches on some of your other questions in the process):

The CH Yoke, IMO, is a much better choice than the Saitek for these two reasons:

1. There is no centering indent / spring in the CH, making it perfectly smooth in this area. The Saitek's centering indent / spring ends up being "in the way"when doing subtle changes. You have to push through this barrier, which causes a sort of back and forth, of over controlling.

2. The general spring tension is linear in the CH, whereas in the Saitek, it seems once you get the stick moving past the centering indent / spring, the tension is uniform. This uniform spring tension makes it hard to feel when you are moving the stick, whereas the CH yoke gets stronger with more deflection.

If setup properly with our planes, the CH makes you feel almost one with the aircraft. I can never get close to this feeling with the Saitek.

Having said this, Saitek makes outstanding throttles, rudder pedals, switch panels, and the best $50 you can spend on hardware - the elevator trim wheel. This trim wheel will change everything for flying - it really puts you in the cockpit. The Saitek throttles have excellent resolution (CH throttles don't compare to Saitek in this regard). And the Saitek control panels are well engineered, high quality pieces of equipment especially for the price.

Scott.

While Saitek have always been good partners of A2A, their yokes are very poor in terms of giving any feel of flight. First, the yoke has a hard center detent, and second the spring force is more or less constant, and doesn't increase with deflection. In other words, once you get the yoke through the detent, the force it takes to pull it to the full travel is just slightly more.

The CH Products yokes, are very different in that there is no center detent and the spring force is natural and increases as you pull back.

Also, the Saitek yokes also have a tendency to stick, making matters worse.

However, Saitek make excellent throttles, a great elevator trim wheel and pretty good rudder pedals.

Scott.

The Saitek Cessna Yoke was my first yoke purchase, but I wasn't really satisfied with it for the reasons Scott mentions. I later decided to try the CH Flight Sim Yoke and found it to be much better.

As Nick pointed out, many of us also use quite a bit of other add-on software besides aircraft. There is some really great stuff out there. For example, if you're looking for some excellent add-on scenery, check out Orbx FTX: https://fullterrain.com/.

I hope that's helpful. Glad to have you on the forums!

[rgenet]

Hi Russ - welcome to the forums. I can't answer all your questions as I've never bothered with advanced hardware or a multi-monitor setup myself, but I'll get you started...

** I presume FSX Steam is the basic software I need. Any best place to buy it?

Either The Steam Edition of FSX or Lockheed Martin's Prepar3d ("P3D") are the best options. P3D is still being developed and offers slightly more advanced rendering and lighting options with the same basic platform; however, it's a bit more demanding on hardware. For a laptop, FSX-SE is probably the best bet, though I'm sure there are plenty of folks who run P3D happily on gaming laptops too. Either software title can be purchased from the links above; just bear in mind that A2A offers a separate version for each in their store.

** Of course I'll get the A2A 172. Any other software I need?

No not really, but many FSX/P3D users do also invest in enhanced scenery, airports and weather generation engines as well as various other utilities. You can spend as much or as little as you like.

** I currently have an old HP laptop running XP. However I plan on getting a new laptop with an i7. Needs to be lightweight. Any suggestions of what specks I should consider for my new laptop? Best graphics chip?

Not really much experience of gaming spec laptops, but NVIDIA graphics cards are almost universally recognised to be the best for FSX/P3D.

I'm sure others will chip in too...

Hi Nick,

Many thanks for your help! I went ahead and purchased the FSX Steam as it will place less of a load on laptops.
I also purchased the A2A 172.

I would like to get nice scenery for local airports. I fly out of San Luis Obispo, CA. Any suggestions where to look for scenery downloads?

Thanks and cheers, Russ

[rgenet]

Hi Scott,

Many thanks for your helpful reply.

I ordered the CH yoke. I also ordered the Saitek trim wheel (I am a great believer in lots of trimming!).

I already have CH rudder pedals. How do they stack up with respect to Saitek pedals?

Perhaps the next thing to purchase is the Saitek throttle. I presume the (low cost) one with three push pull is best and just ignore the center prop one (unless I upgrade to a 182--unlikely).

This is a really helpful support group! Much appreciated!

Cheers, Russ

Hi, Russ, and welcome to the forums! You've come to the right place if you want the most realistic aircraft in the world of flight simulation!

Nick has answered a few of your questions, and I'm sure others will chime in. I'll address an aspect of one of your questions:

** What are the most important physical controls or other goodies to purchase? I presume the Cessna yoke and rudder peddles are a must.

The question of what yoke to buy is a little controversial among flight simmers, and you can find several threads on the topic on these forums. I'll weigh in with my personal opinion. I have owned both the Saitek Pro Flight Cessna Yoke and the CH Products Flight Sim Yoke, and I would recommend the CH Flight Sim Yoke instead of the Saitek Cessna Yoke. Scott (the owner of A2A Simulations) gives, IMO, a very good description of Saitek vs. CH Products yokes in these two posts (and maybe touches on some of your other questions in the process):

The CH Yoke, IMO, is a much better choice than the Saitek for these two reasons:

1. There is no centering indent / spring in the CH, making it perfectly smooth in this area. The Saitek's centering indent / spring ends up being "in the way"when doing subtle changes. You have to push through this barrier, which causes a sort of back and forth, of over controlling.

2. The general spring tension is linear in the CH, whereas in the Saitek, it seems once you get the stick moving past the centering indent / spring, the tension is uniform. This uniform spring tension makes it hard to feel when you are moving the stick, whereas the CH yoke gets stronger with more deflection.

If setup properly with our planes, the CH makes you feel almost one with the aircraft. I can never get close to this feeling with the Saitek.

Having said this, Saitek makes outstanding throttles, rudder pedals, switch panels, and the best $50 you can spend on hardware - the elevator trim wheel. This trim wheel will change everything for flying - it really puts you in the cockpit. The Saitek throttles have excellent resolution (CH throttles don't compare to Saitek in this regard). And the Saitek control panels are well engineered, high quality pieces of equipment especially for the price.

Scott.

While Saitek have always been good partners of A2A, their yokes are very poor in terms of giving any feel of flight. First, the yoke has a hard center detent, and second the spring force is more or less constant, and doesn't increase with deflection. In other words, once you get the yoke through the detent, the force it takes to pull it to the full travel is just slightly more.

The CH Products yokes, are very different in that there is no center detent and the spring force is natural and increases as you pull back.

Also, the Saitek yokes also have a tendency to stick, making matters worse.

However, Saitek make excellent throttles, a great elevator trim wheel and pretty good rudder pedals.

Scott.

The Saitek Cessna Yoke was my first yoke purchase, but I wasn't really satisfied with it for the reasons Scott mentions. I later decided to try the CH Flight Sim Yoke and found it to be much better.

As Nick pointed out, many of us also use quite a bit of other add-on software besides aircraft. There is some really great stuff out there. For example, if you're looking for some excellent add-on scenery, check out Orbx FTX: https://fullterrain.com/.

I hope that's helpful. Glad to have you on the forums!

[Nick - A2A]

I would like to get nice scenery for local airports. I fly out of San Luis Obispo, CA. Any suggestions where to look for scenery downloads?

The https://fullterrain.com/ site suggested by BPL is probably the best place to start Russ. They sell a Southern California 'terrain region' which should help to improve the landscape visuals and the default airports in your part of the world. However, I do recommend getting the sim set up with default scenery and experimenting with the graphics settings to see what sort of frame rate you get before investing in any add-on scenery.

Cheers,
Nick

P.S. One other thing. After installing the A2A 172, you should make sure download and run the Accu-Sim updater available here: it includes a few enhancements and fixes not included in the initial download.

[BPL]

Hi Scott,

Many thanks for your helpful reply.

I ordered the CH yoke. I also ordered the Saitek trim wheel (I am a great believer in lots of trimming!).

I already have CH rudder pedals. How do they stack up with respect to Saitek pedals?

Perhaps the next thing to purchase is the Saitek throttle. I presume the (low cost) one with three push pull is best and just ignore the center prop one (unless I upgrade to a 182--unlikely).

This is a really helpful support group! Much appreciated!

Cheers, Russ

You're welcome, Russ!

(Just to clarify, I'm not Scott. I was just quoting some of his comments on yokes. He's the owner of A2A. I'm just some random flight simmer who loves A2A aircraft. )

While I have experience with both Saitek and CH yokes, I don't have any experience with CH rudder pedals, so I can't really compare them with the Saitek ones. You may want to start a thread in the Pilot's Lounge section of the forums if you'd like some feedback on rudder pedals. Some forum members here have a lot of experience with different pedals and could probably give you some help with that. A separate thread on rudder pedals (or other questions you may have) posted to the Pilot's Lounge may get more traffic and more responses from others.

[Lewis - A2A]

If you are in the US and thinking of upgrading your system then I recommend giving these guys a call, there service is second to none and as specialist sim builders from home users to full large sims you can customize to your hearts content and get a kick ass system literally delivered to your door. Plug it in and away you go;
http://jetlinesystems.com/

Let 'em know we sent you and what you want to use the system for and before you know it you'll have all manner of options and quotes for some amazing systems to suit your exact needs.

cheers,
Lewis

[m_disco]

Hi Scott,

Many thanks for your helpful reply.

I ordered the CH yoke. I also ordered the Saitek trim wheel (I am a great believer in lots of trimming!).

I already have CH rudder pedals. How do they stack up with respect to Saitek pedals?

Perhaps the next thing to purchase is the Saitek throttle. I presume the (low cost) one with three push pull is best and just ignore the center prop one (unless I upgrade to a 182--unlikely).

This is a really helpful support group! Much appreciated!

Cheers, Russ

Hi Russ, my suggestions:

I have both the CH and Saitek pedals. I prefer the feeling of the Saitek ones as the physical tension can be adjusted on them where I find the CH ones to be a little light.

For throttles get this one: http://www.saitek.com/uk/prod/tpm.html Don't bother with the cheap Piper style one. It wears out quickly and starts giving you dead zones or spikes with the throttle input.

Get the switch panel: http://www.saitek.com/uk/prod/switch.html As you are wanting to supplement real world, it's better to be moving you hands to check mags/master/switches etc. than just clicking the mouse

Also you may want to consider the TrackIR: https://naturalpoint.com/trackir/ It makes flying a pattern in the simulator so much easier. It also lets you do things like check that the fire extinguisher is charged between the seats.

This is the setup I have including the trim wheel and yoke that you have already purchased to supplement my RW flying.